Dud Bread

Looks as if you are over-proofing. Watch the 2nd rise more carefully and before it doubles, say x1.75, do the finger-poke test; i.e., prod it with your finger and if the dough springs back, leave it a bit longer but if the depression remains, put it in the oven. HTH Graham

This usually happens when the dough rises to it's limit and collapses from having been held, or risen, too long.

The most likely issues are:

1. Too much yeast, and
2. An over-proofed dough that collapses from having extended too far.

Reducing the yeast is a good solution for both of these issues. Also, reducing the amount of water in the dough can help.

Of course, there are other issues. I don't know how experienced a baker you are, so when you say the dough is well-kneaded, I don't know if I'd agree. Does it pass the windowpane test?

I find that proofing yeast is really not necessary. In the early 1970's, when I was learning to bake, James Beard in his "Beard on Bread" suggested that yeast was so reliable there was no longer any need to proof it - just accept it was going to work. I did, and I've *NEVER* had a problem I could trace to yeast problems. (Some people tell me that doughs with lots of egg and/or oil should still use proofed yeast, as the oils seem to inhibit the yeast too much.)

So... suggestions...

1. Try making the bread without proofing the yeast. Just add the water you were using to proof the yeast to the recipe, and omit any sugar that was used in proofing altogether. Yeast does NOT need sugar to raise bread.

1a. If that doesn't help, try reducing the amount of yeast you are using by 1/4.

1. Try testing the dough with the windowpane test, if you aren't already doing so.

2. Put a bit of dough into a measuring cup as you form the loaves so you can see how much the dough has risen. Say, 1/4 cup. When the dough in the measuring cup has risen to between 1/2 and 3/4 cup, bake the dough. Letting it rise farther can cause problems.

1. If the problems continue, consider reducing the amount of water in the dough slightly.

Mike

Another trick to stop over-proofing dough is to take a small amount of the dough when you are shaping the loaves, about the size of a pea. Roll it into a boll, having taken it from the punched down dough you are just putting into the loaf pan or free form onto the baking sheet or stone for that final rise. Put it into a glass of room temperature water - basically the same temperature as the rise is starting at. It should sink to the bottom of that glass. When that ball rises to the top of the water, having generated enough internal gas to lift it up to the top, the loaf is ready to be baked and will NOT collapse when you then turn up the oven to 350=B0 or whatever and pop the loaf in or leave the loaf in to bake, depending on your choice of technique.

Of course when that ball rises to the top of the water your loaf in the loaf pan may still be well below the rim of the pan, and therefore not what you want. This simply means that next time you need to have MORE dough in that pan or make other adjustments. If you know you are making a bread such as English Muffin bread, where you WANT large holes and may want to over-proof the dough, leave it to rise more, but expect it to collapse a bit. Else bake at once... and expect a more dense loaf that HAS risen enough according the the yeast you used and the dough you made.

FWIW

RsH

Thanks All; You have given me hope and some things to try. When the bread turns out well it is a treat. Will look forward to trying your suggestions. (Probably overproofed so will eliminate that step first) Noel