OT: My Kids (long and not at all happy)

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Christina Peterson" :

]I must be a rotten mother. I have rejoiced every time they have taken off ]on a new adventure -- whether going to kindergarten, or leaving to teach in ]Eastern Europe.

no - not rotten. just different from me. and i love that they are making decisions and creating lives of their own. i just miss having them around.

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

I have cats, because I cannot have kids for several reasons. They are wonderful - very self suffucient and at the same time, loving and nurturing.

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Kandice Seeber" :

]Oh, ((((((hugs)))))) Vicki. :(

thanks. i feel like i lost my best friend, and i still can't talk about him without the tears. sorry.

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

I'll provide treats for the low-carb crowd, so we don't have to drool with envy over the pies and fresh croissants...

Deirdre

Hardly a bad mom! A good mom is allowed to rejoice for the successful raising of a child. Our goal after all is to raise them to the point where they dont need us anymore. I am so happy that my son is out on his own. I miss him like crazy but still wouldnt want him to have to return. We give them wings and a rudder.. .. hmmm brain fart.. thats not how it goes but its close enough. Diana

And as a virtual relation, there are dozens, even thousands of versions of you to go around. While each person who wants a 'remedial' sibling or cousin or parent can have one of their own, who gives them their complete and total attention.

No sibling rivalry.

Deirdre

Oh, what a blow! Very sorry you had to deal with this big loss just when your 'empty nest' feelings were incubating.

May you not have anything on this scale to deal with for a long time to come...

Deirdre

Well, I personally think that consciousness is not dependent on a body. It expresses itself in time and space -through- a body, but it exists timelessly and infinitely without losing its power of perception.

So, if you are willing to entertain that possibility, I would say that just the fact that you are expressing your love of your grandfather

-now- means that he is able to know and experience that love directly from you, even if he can't give direct feedback to let you know that the communication loop is still complete.

I also suggest that if you still have the physical sensations of grief and regret around your memory of his departure without a statement of love, then make that statement now, -as if- he were still present to tune it in, and then see if that changes how you feel.

Or imagine yourself in his hospital room on the day you last saw him 'in the body', in as much physical detail as you can, and in that context, say what you wanted to have said.

There are parts of us that respond to images and actions more than to ideas. Go beyond the idea to the action, and you may find something shifts at the emotional level.

Whether you think of this in spiritual or psychological terms doesn't really matter ... if it works, who cares why it works?

Deirdre

I wasn't referring to 'empty nest' moms here. I was thinking more about people like Sooz' mother, and Karlee's MIL, and others who don't nurture their kids, but try to accomplish their -own- ends through them, without respect for their basic autonomy.

Sorry if I wasn't clear about that, or if the context of the conversation seemed to suggest that the people who miss their kids when they leave are in some way unhealthy for feeling that way.

Deirdre

Very carefully. In both senses of the word. And with lots of contingency plans.

If you can't leave the house comfortably, who can you invite to come to you? And on what terms can you make such visits work, so you aren't overtaxed, but the other person has a good time?

Deirdre

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from Deirdre S. :

]Oh, what a blow! Very sorry you had to deal with this big loss just ]when your 'empty nest' feelings were incubating. ] ]May you not have anything on this scale to deal with for a long time ]to come...

thanks, dear. walking in the door is still hard. i always joked that he was my "Johnny replacement" when Johnny went away to school.

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

You mean children don't get born by mistake?

Tina

Control surfaces on a airplane are also called rudders. See, You were right.

Tina

How about step daughter from marriage to a man twice your age?

Tina

I have enjoys so much about you. This about not being able to leave the house is very distressing. Even pathological. A care giver cannot survive without feeding his or her own identity. And the person being cared for also doesnot thrive this way. It sounds like your husband is damagingly controlling. You really really really need some time for yourself.

Tina

On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 23:35:56 -0400, bluemaxx wrote (in message ):

I'm sorry to hear that. Please, of course, feel free to have me as a Part/Time mama or sister, or cousin, or Auntie Kath. Whatever fills your needs at the moment. You aren't required to keep the relationship static: if you need a mom today and a sister tomorrow, that works, too.

I'm hoping to get to the ISGB gathering in Lowell in August, and I'm planning to go to Tink's Florida adventure in January. As far as I know, those are the only get-togethers I know about right now.

Being a virtual mother is great. My figure has suddenly gone from "eh" to "Holy Carp, that's fantastic for having all those kids."

I have one request: with all that's going on, I can't keep all this straight. Please drop me an email with the relationship you want, your birthday, something important you want me to know about you, and your favorite color. Even a mom needs her "little black book."

Kathy N-V

On Fri, 11 Jul 2003 0:48:03 -0400, Christina Peterson wrote (in message ):

Already married, and my DH is only six months older than I. (Which makes him an old coot for half the year) But this is a virtual family: you are welcome to be a stepdaughter, and whoever this guy is can be my cousin. The virtual part is even better - I can be Mom to people who are older than I am.

Remember this is all wholesome and meant to build us up, so I won't tolerate any "Deliverance" type jokes or you hillbillies all marry your cousins and the like. If you'd met me in person, you'd realize that there is no one further from Hillbilly-dom.

Kathy N-V

I'm so sorry. You were able to take the baby the day before he passed away, and that's gotta count for something.

You just did. I truly believe that the ones we love aren't truly and completely gone from our lives until there is no one left to remember them. Their physical bodies might be gone, but part of them is here. With my MIL, it's rather funny. She was very particular about holiday meals - and we all hear her telling us what to do when we prepare them, just as if she were there. It's not eerie or frightening, it's just knowing how much she gave to our lives and that she still lives on in our hearts.

You did nothing wrong, although I know why you cried. Maybe your Grampa's gift was in those tears, because look what they led to:

Within a month I had gone to see, or called on

You're loved here.

Kathy N-V

On Fri, 11 Jul 2003 0:39:48 -0400, Christina Peterson wrote (in message ):

Surprise, perhaps; but never, ever a mistake. That's one of my hot buttons

-- my parents married because they were expecting me. Thus, (in their minds), it was my fault when they had marital difficulties. "If it wasn't for you, I wouldn't have have to marry that X, and you were a mistake.!"

Between that and my paternal grandmother, who took every opportunity to tell me that my mother slept around and that I am not my father's daughter. (From when I was about four on up) I had a pretty bad view of myself.

Until _The Day I Had Had Enough._ (Insert dah-dah-DAH music in here) I was getting ready to get married, and my soon to be ex-boyfriend and I were there with both of them making plans. An argument over something trivial ensued, and they were tag teaming me. My mother hissed "It figures that you'd give us trouble on this. You were a mistake, and we've been paying ever since.!"

Soon to be ex boyfriend (Now DH) gasped. This was totally outside his experience, where children came when they came, and were treasured when they arrived. I was aghast, and from somewhere deep inside, I summoned my courage and told the two of them off. I think I had fire shooting from my eyes, but it was my words that had them openmouthed.

"You think I'm a freakin' mistake?!? The only mistake made was that you two jerks didn't use a condom, and that's hardly something you can blame on me. Look in the mirror if you want someone to blame. All my life you've wanted me to apologize for being born. Well, I won't. I'm a good person, everyone besides you loves me, so that makes me the think the problem is not with me. So, I never, ever want to hear that freakin' mistake line again, as long as I live."

They were incensed that I spoke up to them, but didn't say a word about the "mistake" line. They've never used it again, either.

DD once asked me if she was a mistake or a surprise baby, since her schoolmates sometimes use that line. I told her that Daddy and I had been married for _years_ before we started a family, and that we wanted to have her more than anything. She was planned and loved from before she was conceived, and the only "mistake" was that she was three weeks overdue -- we wanted a November baby, and she was born Dec. 10.

We often joke that I make conditions in there _too_ nice, and I should have raised the rent or something so she'd have left on time.

What a hideous thing to say to anyone - You may have come uninvited to the party, but now that you're here, we are delighted and can't imagine having had the party without you.

Kathy N-V