Centering and throwing

one thought that finally made sence to me was the process is really a spin form extrusion.

*extrusion* to me helps me understand that the foundation (me) needs to be solid & firm.

extrusions happen when something is compressed inside something else & allowed to escape in a controled manner.

see ya

steve

In article , DKat writes

I think the only comment I would make is to keep the speed sort of mid- range; with some wheels maximum is so fast it can mean the clay taking control rather than being controlled, especially for those who are in the early stages of learning. I learnt on a seated Treadle Wheel with a one to one kick/rotation ratio, and still prefer a slow moving wheel-head to a fast one.

Steve Bath UK

Ohh I learnt first on a tread wheel, but mostly on an electric wheel. I much prefer speed. I go flat out for centering, that way the wheel does most of the work for you. I find it much more hard work to centre on a kick wheel. A

yeah but when you try a big pile of clay "flat out" might knock you out!

slow down on the pounds!

~ just like the diet i don't follow...

see ya

steve

Yes. -

I find it very difficult to explain to anyone what the 'right' speed is but it really can make a difference in how easy things can be. Faster speeds give you more force but less control.

You start out patting the clay to center at a moderate to slow speed. If you are going too 'slow' then it gets more off center than on - too fast and you have no control and again it becomes more off center. Same for wheel wedging and centering. Fast gives you the helping force you need to center but too fast and you lose control. Too fast on a pull and you get too much clay going up at once and you end up tearing off. Too slow and you can't get a decent pull. I learned to throw on a Shimpo and have one now. I really like the handle for controlling speed which to me much easier than the pedal. Speeds that work for one person don't work for another. When you use a kick wheel you become more conscious of what the speed of the wheel is doing. For those who have never had that experience I suggest - when things don't 'feel' right, try changing the speed of your wheel.

I guess it depends on your wheel. The electric wheels I have used probably do not go as fast as a Shimpo which I believe is a more professional production type wheel. The electric wheels that I use are Talisman which I believe is just a NZ brand. Anyway, I work by going flat out for centering, most people that I have seen demonstrate do the same and it is most certainly the way I teach, you do not loose control, but the wheel does more of the work for you. However once centred it is necessary to slow down to keep control. Hey I guess we are all different.

In article , dkat writes

I agree with you there; speed is a very personal thing. The aspect of the treadle wheel I particularly liked is that it became part of me, more so than my electric wheel, as I was the motive power as well as the user. Sadly aged and overworked joints couldn't cope with the heavier weights any more so now I rely on a motor and pedal.

Steve

In article , Xtra News writes

Interestingly the wheel I now use is made in NZ by Cowley, It is a bullet-proof piece of kit with the only totally indestructible splash tray I have ever met made of heavy-duty Polypropylene. It has very simple drive mechanism, and it goes on for ever!

Steve

I have used a Shimpo for the last 20 years or so. (I also learned it on a kickwheel). And my rule of thunb is, - full speed for centering, for opening the clay, and then, the thinner the wall, the slower the speed. Once you have a thin neck, you go very, very slowly.

In general, i find it extremely hard to explain throwing in words. Which is the reason why i don't understand the original posters post. You simply can't put it in words. Every so often, when i have a student at the wheel asking questions, i tell them "let me sit down and show you what i do".

The one advice which i can endorse is, when you feel the clay is centered, let go very, very gently. Too many times the clay will go out of center when you let go to suddenly.

The rest, i think, is just learned by doing. To many beginners think there must be a way to be told how it works. --- There isn't! just keep at it and it will come. Everybody does it a bit differently.

Monika

-- Monika Schleidt snipped-for-privacy@schleidt.org

if you wish to write me a mail, remove the number from my user name

"i find it extremely hard to explain throwing in words". ~ Monika

~ so i became and engineer, got hooked on pottery, and started teaching...

THEN i tried to explain throwing to people. my fall back initially was technical terms which lay people don't normally connect with.

i found my vocabulary changing & today i don't seem to be a *normal* engineer...

i have to say i've done ok with most everyone i taught being able to throw a pot on the 1st or 2nd try.

~ then the deaf girl showed up!

i must have done alright because she took the class several sessions & even brought in three of her deaf friends. try adding THAT challenge to the class!

PUSH would be the most lacking element of centering. "take charge" of the clay is another.

~ i forget what the technical terms for that actually are anymore...

see ya

steve

Yes familiar with them and have used them. The splash tray on the talisman is strong too and they go for years often lasting the life time of potters :o)

Exactly Monika, everyone is has a slightly different technique and practise is the only way to master it

We have had posters that have hit the wall and not been able to figure out what they were doing wrong in their throwing. I was adding my thoughts on where some problems come up and the insights I have had from my own throwing.

I agree completely that there are no rules to throwing but it helps to see things from other people's perspective. I thought Steve's description "...[the] process is really a spin form extrusion" was brilliant. I like your generalization that the thinner the wall the slower the speed.

What I and others have said may not make any sense to most but if it clicks for just one person, that makes it worth the bandwidth I think.

Oh hey I agree its great to have a go at describing techniques. It may just help some people too, different things "click" with different people. I agree with Monika too though that some people expect easy answers when really it is only practise that gets you there. Doesn't mean we should stop trying though :o)

A famous psychologist (NOT CLINICAL! - yes there are many fields out there in psychology that have absolutely nothing to do with how you feel about your mother) concluded that to be at a professional level in any field that you had to put in 5000 hours. It doesn't matter really how they are done (over a span of months, over a span of decades, etc), just that they are done. You do however have to have some basic understanding of what you are doing in the first place. That is - it helps to have a boot strap to get on the horse.

i heard a potter describe the same except via a few tons of clay...

see ya

steve

Hi DK!

I thank you very much for starting this thread! I haven't read through it until now, because I wanted to be totally in control of my senses - ie. nobody else awake and my visiting mother stays up as late as I do! LOL!

I have copied several tips into a text file I called "Sound bytes" and stored it in my pottery folder. These will then get laminated and hung up around my "studio" (cell?) for my eyes to fall on every now and then. Those about throwing, of course by the wheel for the most part.

I really pay attention when you guys start discussing your different techniques! Some of them sound just perfect for me - others sound like I might try and see if they work for me. I usually try them all as I go on on my learning-spree :-)

Thanks again!

Marianne

well, here's one to add...

at the end of a day producing work, make a piece for YOU!

while making a series is good to do, end the day on an up note by throwing pots maybe BIGGER then you're used to, THINNER, TALLER, etc. something different.

see ya

steve