craft/art article by Grayson Perry

What do you all think of this article?? Be really interested to hear, do you like his work. I love it, but it sure is controversial. I listened to him give a talk a couple months ago. A very interesting man. Anyway here is the article

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Annemarie

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Xtra News
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I think if they ate more fruit they might be more regular and be less full of crap. But that is just my opinion. After I chew on it a bit I will respond more responsibly and with more thought. Donna

Reply to
DKat

interesting, i agree with some. some not:

"And yet, the traditional craft areas have dried up."

well a lot of art & craft has been dropped by schools so the exposure us older folk might have had isn't occuring anymore. ~ and since we saw it *a lot* growing up, now today we don't, but that doesn't mean it's dried up - just not openly visible anymore. ~ no teachers taking us to see it or showing us anymore.

"Craft has lost its way and become precious; self-consciousness is one of its great cankers."

it's precious now that it IS handmade. never before has the industrialized world been SO much made of strictly manufactured stuff! so for someone to step forward & perform his craft - he'll stand out & may look cankerous to some. ~ like that guy on a street corner playing saxaphone. he sure stands out! and he's not usually very good! but you can't paint the music profession on such obvious people.

see ya

steve

Xtra News wrote:

listened to

Reply to
slgraber

It looks like Perry has craftskill, but his stuff is as ugly as he is in a dress. He is no artist. I am guessing he couldn't make it as a painter so he took to decorating badly formed pots.

-- Lee In Mashiko, Japan

Reply to
Lee In Mashiko, Japan

interesting lee, i thought his work reflected some Escher influence & i kinda liked the business of the pieces. you have to look at them for a while to start to see it all together.

~ but he sure is pretty ugly in a dress...

see ya

steve

Lee > It looks like Perry has craftskill, but his stuff is as ugly as he is

decorating

Reply to
slgraber

I dislike rigid definitions; I feel they are constricting and often send the wrong messages. There is no need to pigeon-hole anything to do with Art-Craft, they are inseparable. If a piece of work *speaks* to me, that is what matters, not how it was made, whether it is a pot, a painting, a bridge, a building, or whatever. That it provokes a favourable reaction in me is what matters.

Steve Bath UK

In article , A & V writes

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Reply to
Steve Mills

Reply to
A & V

I forgot to add - While Grayson Perry's work is not at all to my taste, I would not question his ability as an artist. His work is highly skilled, dramatic and it without question generates emotions.

DK

Reply to
DKat

I have enjoyed the debate that is going on concerning art and craft. This may be oversimplified, but I have always considered making the pot, the sculptural form, or painting, as the craft. The art is the result of the craft, or the actual piece. Just my 2 cents.

Johnny Horner

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Reply to
Johnny

you've got something there ~ the *craft* process is sure fun, and when done we often say "now THAT's one nice piece!" followed by, "yeah, and look at THIS one!".

~ make more!

we just had a raku party the other night - some 40 people. you should have heard the conversations around the finished pieces table that night..

for me, a fat guy former gymnast, pottery is very much like gymnastics. we learn the technique, and try & try & try again to make that perfect pot. it's simply fun enough to stay at it. yet with the right passion we slowly get into the 8's and 9's with our work.

see ya

steve

Johnny wrote:

Reply to
slgraber

Its a pleasure. We changed server and for some reason the newsgroups were not working properly for a while and consiquently I ended up starting a thread and then missing most of the interesting comments after. I tend to agree with a lot of what he said too, whats more I think his work is really great. The fact that the posts are handmade makes them less perfect than thrown vessels but thats ok with me. I listened to a talk by him when he came to NZ and he was dressed in a little girl dress then too. He was fascinating to listen to, very knowledgable charming. He showed slides of his work and life and there were a couple of photos of him in adult female clothing and he actually looked pretty good :o) Whatever, I think that fact that he is a tranny is irrelevant to his work. Some of his work is challenging, ie the subject matter is rather strong, but it sure as heck evokes a response, and that to me means art :o) Annemarie

Reply to
Xtra News

It can be taken as offensive, but in my experience there is an element of truth in it. I have heard potters/ceramic artists moan that their work takes more skill, more learning, etc than painting, yet a painting will sell for more. There is an element of truth in this. At a demostration by a master potter who is also a painter, he painted a wonderful free flowing scene on a large open bowl with underglaze. Held it up, we all went wow, then he commented that if he had painted it on paper he could have sold it for more, yet the skill of throwing this huge open bowl was undeniable. I think though what Perry was pointing out is that if you want to succeed as a crafts person, thats ok, make lovely functional work, sell it in craft exhibitions and stalls etc. But if you want to succeed as an artist you need to have something different and new and you need to sell and exhibit in Art exhibitions. It is a choice I have made not to be involved with craft markets and the like. I only put my work into good exhibitions. :o) Its a big topic, I am sorry I missed lots of it because of computer problems. Annemarie

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Xtra News

Monika

Reply to
Monika Schleidt

Yeah... Like when you get the perfect glaze combination that is oh so sweet... There is a certain magic in the craft and every kiln opening is a like opening a treasure chest. I love it!

Reply to
DKat

I haven't had a chance to visit here for a while, and now half of the discussion is not accessible. Pity. Monika - English word is possibly "maker" that some people use to describe themselves ( not a perfect translation, though) However, I was browsing through my papers and found a Quote from Douglas Adams that I found worthwhile coping:

..."I get very worried about this idea of Art. I think that idea of Art kills creativity. ....And if somebody wants to come along and say"oh,it's art" that is as it might be,but I think that's for the other people to decide after the fact. It isn't what you should be aiming to do. There is nothing worse than sitting down to write a novel and saying "well, okay, I'm going to do something of high artistic worth".....But I think that you get most of the most interesting things done in fields where people don't think they are doing art, bat are merely practicing a craft, and working as good craftsman. ...I tend to get suspicious of anything that thinks it's art while it is being created....."

what do you think?? Andrea

Reply to
A & V

I agree. And I agree with Grayson Perry. Part of what I see as an issue is that some people feel that craft is somehow less worthy than art. And that is not true. To me craft implies technical competence and art implies emotion and expression. They are not exclusive of each other. I feel that there are craftspeople who are not artists - perhaps to be less controversial a newsreporter is a craftsperson...but a poet is an artist....and when that newsreporter is writing poetry he is an artist. Now an artist has a craft....and may be competent or maybe practicing. Let's take poetry. One could follow the rules of haiku to write an automobile ad and that is low on the artistic scale, but successful on the craft scale. Children's pictures are often high on the artistic scale (especially therapeutic works) but because of their lack of skill, may not be high on the "craft" of painting, drawing etc. Most of us work hard to improve our craft so that we can be more successful and more pleased personally or professionally with our expression. As a potter, I work on new skills and improving old ones so I have multiple ways to express or build what is in my head....my craft though remains mediocre.

I also think that one can become so focused on craft and technique that they lose balance and find themselves with technically wonderful work that is not very interesting or even personally satisfying. It may. however, still be very profitable. I have an acquaintance who does wildlife art. His style is pen and ink pointillism - and he says he pursues this because it sells. He is very technically competent, but has works do not pull emotion from folks - but they are very decorative and sell well. However, he is not happy and doesn't enjoy doing these. But by his own admission, he keeps score by $$$. (And fibs about his sales!)

Of course having spent the first half of my life in the corporate world, I may have a different personal definition. I do believe that the business person is a craftsperson...and can be very competent - even at high levels, but not an artist. However, there is also an art to business that comes from inspiration, creativity. To me invention is art. Alexander Graham Bell's first phone is a work of art. But then I have some antique garden tools that I feel are art...not in the "garden art" decorative sense...but art because of the stories of use and gardens past that they evoke in my mind's eye.

Well I have rambled long for a rainy Friday, I think I shall wander into my studio.

Reply to
Stephanie Coleman

Nicely said Stephanie! Andrea

Reply to
A & V

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