?? Is something knit on a manual knitting machine "hand knit"?

Hand manipulated kntting IS considered hand-knit, Aaron..... JM2C, Hugs, Noreen

What stitches or patterns can I do that a knitting frame/machine can not?

On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:53:32 GMT, spewed forth :

Unless the knitting machine works under its own power, can effect the color changes, increases, decreases, cable crosses, bobbles, purls, etc all by its onesome it is indeed hand knit.

I bill my machine-knit socks as hand-cranked. The machine speeds along the knitting process, but it doesn't know how to turn a heel or toe.

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YO's, PSSO's well, actually you CAN do them on a knitting machine or knitting frame, come to think of it! But, you CANT do garter stitch, it's stockinette only, LOL! Noreen

nod nod nod, eggsacterly. One still has to manipulate, especially lacey things too! JM2C, Noreen

On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 15:47:20 -0600, " YarnWright" spewed forth :

Oh, you can produce garter stitch on a knitting machine. Its a real PITA though. Its the hand-manipulation that puts me off of doing anything but stockinette yardage on the flatbed knitter or stripes on the CSM.

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So, with the proper attachments and skills, any stitch or pattern can be knit on a machine?

Aaron

Thanks!!

POP! POP! That sound you hear is my eyes opening!

Aaron

At the industrial level, who knows. Anything is possible, but that doesn't mean it will be cost-efficient.

The toes and heels on cheap white athletic socks are sewn to shape, not knitted that way - its because the high-speed knitting machines that know how to make a short row heel (computer driven) have "issues" that make it cheaper and easier for the Chinese sock factories to employ cheap labor to do the toe and heel shapings by hand.

High-dollar flatbed knitting machines for home use are capable of producing intarsia and fair isle with the proper attachments, but there's still an awful lot of handwork involved to ensure the color changes happen correctly and the tension remains consistent throughout the work. To the best of my knowledge there's no attachment anywhere that'll let a machine do cable crosses and bobbles and heavy texture without human intervention. Of course, I've been wrong before and I could be wrong now.

The average consumer neither knows nor cares if there is a difference between "hand finished" which describes most commercially-produced sweaters and "hand knit" which describes the things we knit by hand.

On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 21:53:36 GMT, spewed forth :

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Thanks! From now on everything gets bobbles and cable crosses whether it needs it or not; just so people will know it is HAND knit with needles in hand by the latest of the ladies.

Aaron

Same here somebody sold me one of those ESM , i only make some plain knitting and than use them as basis to go on , mirjam ps don`t even make yardage once the weight comes to the floor , rolling it on itself never produces nice results ... mirjam

Aha sock machine ???? drooling some moments , can it make sleeves ? mirjam

On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 05:25:47 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@actcom.co.il (Mirjam Bruck-Cohen) spewed forth :

Of course! It doesn't like yarn much bigger than a 2/12s though!

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Aaron

Sorry to burst your bubble, you can easily do lace, bobbles, and cable crosses on a knitting machine. They require hand manipulation and even have special tools to help you cross cables. There's also a technique developed by one woman called "Magic Cables" (see

in which you set your machine to knit a tuck pattern, and you lift stitches up to form mock cables. With a ribber attachment, available for higher end machines, you can very easily create things like moss and seed stitch.

It's been debated in various places on the net about calling it "hand knit". Some are going PC and calling it "frame knit" versus "needle knit", as the frame holds the stitches, very similar to but not exactly like knitting needles do. But, unless you have an electronic knitting machine with a motor of some sort and a lot of preprogrammed patterns without shaping, you are creating every stitch using your hands, and the "transfer tools" that you use to make bobbles and cables are just a variation of a hand needle type cable needle, and you still need to create any bobbles and cables and garment shaping by hand. If doing any color work, unless you have an expensive electronic and program the pattern in, you are selecting all the needles taking fair isle and manipulating multiple colors for intarsia by hand.

The tradeoff for needle versus frame knitting is that needle knitting can be carried practically anywhere, while a frame/machine is not portable while you've got a project on the needles but does all the plain stitches faster.

I have a knitting machine, which I use about as much as I do all my needles. However, if I want something done in the round, most KM's don't handle that, and if I want portable, that means needles. Are both enjoyable? To me, yes. Do I consider my machine "cheating"? No.

If you call maching knitting cheating to a machine knitter, hardcore machine knitters (not me) will likely say you're cheating to drive a car anywhere rather than walking with your own God-given 2 feet, cheating to buy your food in a grocery store rather than growing it yourself, etc. It's only a different type of tool than needles, and it's been around for 400 years, which I think may be longer than circular needles have been around, so a hardcore knitter of either variety might call circular needles "cheating" ;-).

Leah

Beautifully expressed, Leah! :) Noreen

On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 07:34:03 -0700, Leah spewed forth :

Right - doing anything but plain old stockinette on a home flatbed machine requires hand manipulation, for the most part. I think that's what we've been saying all along...

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Is *manual* knitting machine knitting, (even doing the cables etc. by hand) MUCH faster than hand knitting? I.e., Do we hand needle knit because we can do things that machines can not do? Or, because we enjoy the touch and feel of hand needle knitting? Or, because we do not have a knitting machine? Or, because we need something to do with our hands while waiting, and a knitting frame will not fit in our pocket?

Or, because like me, we do not know about knitting machines?

Or, is it net, net; that manual machine knitting of complex knitting is not enormously faster because of the all hand work? And thus, for a reasonably good knitter producing nice consistent stitches, there is simply not that much advantage to investing in, and supporting a knitting machine?

Aaron

Or you could just crochet instead. ;-)

Lucky you ,,,, thin skinny sleeves are neat mirjam e: