question about copyrights--an innocent question not meant to start a war

Hello, I have a question about copyright law and patterns. I have been thinking about this for a bit. Lets say I decided to get creative and design a sweater. The sweater I am designing (not really but pretend with me) has a 2" ribbing and cables on the front, back and sleeves. The cables crisscross in the front and then go to the back where they cross again. The ones on the sleeves just go down the sleeve. Now I did the pattern and it looks cool so I decide I am going to sell the sweater and maybe the pattern I created. How do I know that someone has not already designed this sweater? There are only so many ways to make cables and sweaters. Like I said this is just something I have been curious about the past few days. Kristine

Reply to
Kristine
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I have wondered the same thing, Kristine. I don't even know how you would do a search to find out if someone else had already made this sweater. I hope someone who *knows* responds.

Katherine

Reply to
Katherine

You seem to be in the United States, so you can consult

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for information on copyright. If it is a design rather than a set of instructions that you want to protect,
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Reply to
j999ax

"Kristine" skrev i melding news: snipped-for-privacy@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

Kristine, I am not American, and my view is just common sence...

I think, If YOU make the pattern, there might be people who have made something similar, BUT I think the two patterns hardly could be the same. The shape will often vary too. It would be easy to see/read that your pattern is constructed by you, if you haven't used another one as base for your sweater. (May be your shape is "the best!!"LOL)

If you see Norwegian sweaters, they often have the same "theme" as pattern. (some patterns are special old traditional, but now I am talking about NEW variations)

IF you knit a sweater to sell, and use the same compositions of patterns, as a copyrighted pattern, you have violated the copyright. But if you use parts of that pattern, put it together with others, or put together with other borders, other colores, constructed in a different way, f.ex. it is YOUR construction. (There are just a few "stars" which you vary in most patterns.)

There has been a case not long ago, where a copyright owner claimed that his right was violated, since the pattern just was altered a little bit, and used by a factory. He got right, and I think he WAS right, his pattern was very popular, and the sweater factory which made the new, wanted it to be as like the popular one as possible.

When YOU make a pattern, it's impossible to know IF anyone has made a similar pattern. I think at least you can be sure that no one has made a quite like pattern! When you make your own pattern, you also vary the shape. But I think, IF I thought I would sell the model, I would search a bit among similar patterns ...just in case... :-))

AUD ;-)

Reply to
Aud

Aud brought up a good point; the copyright laws of various countries vary quite a bit, and in the case of Internet commerce the laws of other jurisdictions might apply.

Reply to
j999ax

Here are two excellent online resources regarding copyright as it pertains to craftspeople and knitters:

Reply to
Kathryn Tewson

Hi Kristine,

There's really no way to know if a design has been done before, without having copies of every knitting pattern ever made. Though some of our pattern collections may look like we've tried, having access to everything just isn't possible :-)

I would suggest that you keep your working notes, and date them so that you have them if anyone ever disputes that the design is your own. You'd have to get legal advice as to what would stand up if a court case ever arose, but I would assume a copy of your notes that are witnessed might be good enough. Take the copy and your original notes and the finished pattern to a justice of the peace when you first finalise the design (I don't know if they have a different title outside of Australia), and get them to witness that they were produced on that date, and that the copies and the originals are the same.

Hope this helps, Sarah

Reply to
knittingand

Sarah, in the US musicians often mail copies of songs that they have written to themselves. The date on the mail provides proof of when the song was written, and satisfies the US court system. DA

Reply to
DA

I second Aud, It is practical impossible to know if someone else created the same pattern you did. I would go ahead and create your own pattern, knit some little designs into it that are just you in volour and shape. Go ahead and sell the garment, or the pattern. Hand knitters never go into huge production lines, so I would think your are fine, and not crossing anyone else's path. We do have to relax about this a bit, otherwise the fun is taken out of designing your own ideas. Naturally these are based on other patterns your learned from. That is how it is for all of us. Can you imagine when letters would have been copy righted....We would be nowhere on this website....LOL

Be creative and make up your own design.

Els

Reply to
Els van Dam

Kristine, since most of the garment I knit are " made up" some totally as I go along and others using perhaps an unusual cable or lace stitch and just adapting it to the garment i wish to make. Right now I am knitting a vest for a friend , using the lace pattern of a sweater with long sleeves made in very thick wool on equally thick needles ,published in the English Women's Weekly in 1988.

This I have adapted to fine yarn on #11 needles and this is now the fifth vest I have done in this way from that pattern. I guess if I sold one it just might be a breach of copyright but the finished garrment bears little resemblance to the original. For instance the original only had 4 1/2 pattern repeats for the full length whereas mine has 11 1/2 due to the fine yarn and needles.

However I have often wondered about this too God Bless gwen

Reply to
Gwendoline Kelly

Sarah, you mention " outside Australia" Does that mean you are in Australia - it has always seemed like I am the lone Australian on the group. If so what part of Aust do you hale from God Bless Gwen

Reply to
Gwendoline Kelly

Hi Gwen,

Yep, I'm in Australia :-)

I'm current;y in Victoria, but moving to New South Wales in a couple of months.

Reply to
knittingand

Reply to
Mirjam Bruck-Cohen

Reply to
Mirjam Bruck-Cohen

This works here as well ,,,, i have at times mailed myself a REGISTERED Letter , and have NOT opened it ,,,[ will do only if needed] But i do keep my copybooks ,and i always write dates on the first page of each new work . mirjam

Reply to
Mirjam Bruck-Cohen

Morjam, you're right. Simple garment shapes can't be copyrighted.

I don't see what being outside of the US has to do with it.

Reply to
knittingand

Apologies for mis-typing your name Mirjam.

Reply to
knittingand

Well I offer you a very big welcome "Knittingand" - I do not think I had noticed any of yourposts before - or maybe just thought of them as being from somewhere else.

I am of the Gold Coast but both out daughters are in Vic, DD#1 is at Collingwood and DD#2 at Bacchus Marsh.

We moved from Sydney to here in 1970 so are now dyed in the wood Queenslanders, God bless gwen

Reply to
Gwendoline Kelly

Reply to
Mirjam Bruck-Cohen

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