OFF TOPIC - the ladybug "lost" her mittens

"lewmew" ,in rec.crafts.textiles.needleworkwrote: and entertained us with

I would do the same unless there were very good reasons for providing one. Someone I know who works for a call centre said that the majority of calls they receive concern huge billings made by teens using cells for the internet and spending hundreds of dollars and the parents (phone in their name) are desperate.

Crazy teens and crazy parents !

Yup...walk home once in the cold, and you won't "forget" your coat the next time. It's called Natural Consequences. Someone should buy that mom a book!

However, I have to laugh at DD, who complains the house is freezing, but she's walking around in a spaghetti-strap tank top, no socks and shoes. Hello! Put on a sweater! Slippers! I tell her when *she* pays the gas and electric in her own house, she can set the thermostat to whatever temperature she wants.

Sue

I'm sorry to disagree with you, but the only reason I always had a coat with me was my mother would have beaten the living s**t out of me if I fought with her about it and like others have said before me, even as a little kid I knew it was wise to pick my battles.

Again I wonder why you would say they have stronger immune systems? How did you come to that conclusion? Are you under the impression that in the 40's and 50's when I was young we sat on our behinds warming our hands over the wood burning stove? We went to school from 8 to 3, we did stuff after school, and we had a ton of homework. The only real difference I can see is that we weren't ferried everywhere by our parents and had to make our way to whatever activity was available.

More to my point, I was never much of a sleeper and I think that's a thing that has to do with the individual and what their body needs.

I agree with Lucille. My mother could make me take my coat, but she could not make me button it.

Pat

Any snow around your area Pat? It seems that up here we may escape unscathed.

You're not disagreeing with me. I agree - your mom forced you to take a coat, and at least you did - even if it wasn't buttoned up.

I came to that conclusion because in the last couple of years there has been research done about kids, especially teens, their health, timing of school and activities, nutrition and sleep. So, a couple of studies showed that the average available time for teenagers to sleep has decreased. And yes, they are getting ferried about- but what that comes to is kids have less time to just "be" as they end up very scheduled. Kids with stiff academic programs and any extr-curricular activities often end up with something like

The general, overall health of todays teens is not improving. The health, and life expectancy in this country was increasing throughout the 20th century - better nutrition, working conditions improving, immunizations, etc. However with the most recent 20 years - nutrition has split - the average has gone down (plenty of food but not healthy), more hours spent on average working -yup the average workday has increased, for kids more time spent in school, etc, and sleep gone down - plus exercise has gone down. Hence the immune systems of adolescents - when you should be at your prime are not as much stronger than children or the elderly as you would expect or they used to be on the whole.

In particular I think the comparison was with my generation, vs yours, and showing talking about trends in the last 25 years.

Absolutely. I don't sleep much either - never have compared to the average. Not necessarily a good thing all through life but it is what it is.

ellice

That's an interesting point. Actually in all the exam rooms at the internal med/fam practice we use they have signs up about this. Telling you that they will not prescribe antibiotics frivolously. There's an info bulletin about the problems caused by overuse of antibiotics, and essentially if you have something that can be dealt with just be addressing the symptoms and wating it out, that is better for your overall health.

I don't know that it's all that our immune systems don't get developed so much, as the other complications of bacteria becoming resistant to the available antibiotics, which then means the body learning an new internal antibody, and pharmacalogically developing new antibiotics. And of course, the real problem with things like viral pneumonia, and other viral infections is that there isn't a magic pill to take care of a virus - they work completely differently. Which most people don't realize.

Ah, well. It's a beautiful 16 F here - looks warmer but not. Driving home last night from hockey game - it was 22 in the parking garage, then went 19 in DC, then I watched the temp drop so that by the time I was home (about 20 miles west and higher elevation) the temp was 11 F - but of course colder with the wind chill. And yes, I ran out of the car to collect things from the hatch and into the house with no coat.

Ellice

"T Michelle Jensen" ,in rec.crafts.textiles.needleworkwrote: and entertained us with

Bang the drum, there's another idiot like me! The other baaad thing, is being in hospital. They are very dangerous places now, rampant with infection. Is it because the bugs are bigger or better ? No ! It's because they do not make nurses and doctors wash their hands properly anymore !!!!

Well, to be fair, some of the bugs *are* bigger and better, and hospital sanitation has always been an issue. I don't think that's anything new. That doesn't excuse it, of course--just observing that it's not anything new, except that the potential for encountering life-threatening germs is higher now. Demanding antibiotics is certainly an issue, and I think it's insane that parents do that. At the same time, you can't get the antibiotics without a prescription. Why the heck do the doctors cave?! I realize that it's unpleasant to have to say no to people, but honestly. Grow a spine.

Best wishes, Ericka

I was agreeing the OP in general. My doctor does not cave, the complaint against him on rateyourmd.com is that he 'doesn't prescribe most of the time'.

In hospital germs and infections had gone with the dodo after Pasteur until someone stopped insisting on hand washing. We have just had a revealing television expose about same, see the worker touch patient A with MRSA then move to change dressing on patient B without washing her hands !

Last night I was talking with a friend (also a nurse) who has just had a knee replacement. She said she was disgusted. She resorted to telling them she wanted to see them wash their hands before they touched her. She feels they are using rubber gloves for their own protection but care less about what they take from one patient to another.

They say everything seems to go in 200 year cycles, this too would appear to do so.

This time I kind of, sort of half agree with you. Yes, there could be better hygiene in hospitals but to be fair there are some super germs that no amount of hand washing or sanitizing of walls and floors will take care of.

When my husband was dreadfully ill he developed a staph infection in one of the best hospitals in the world. They truly were much more careful than most of the hospitals I ever had any experience with but it wasn't enough. I guess with his very suppressed immune system and the medi-port that's a perfect place for a germ to hide, nothing would have been enough short of putting him in a bubble.

Lucille

"Lucille" ,in rec.crafts.textiles.needleworkwrote: and entertained us with

A compromised immune system leaves one very vulnerable, my husband had an infection that ran berserk and killed him. Not in that instance hospital driven, rather we think it was the drug he was testing did too good a job squelching his immune system.

On 2/9/07 2:08 PM, "lucretia borgia" wrote:

Maybe in Canada the handwashing thing is a problem (though I'd be surprised if it's much different than here), but here it's quite the opposite. Protocols, and trust me - or not - if you don't follow them and anyone supervisory or on your team sees you not, you'll definitely hear about it, are very strict about handwashing. US Hospitals are full of handwashing stations. There is antiseptic waterless washing foam now being installed in patient rooms - newer or more recently updated places - have them by the door in every patient room. There are similar stations all over any floor, as well as regular sinks with soap that is used with water. A couple of the hospitals I've been doing clinicals in, or bringing patients to also have switched to the automatic towel dispensers. It is drummed into everyone in the health care profession to wash their hands. In point of fact, they've actually gone away from using gloves all the time - unless there is of course a bodily fluid issue - therefore making it very clear to wash your hands after every patient contact. Even if you are wearing gloves for a procedure - it's still wash your hands. And there are huge canisters or dispensers with special antiseptic wipes at all the washing stations, nurses stations, etc. So, I end up wiping down all kinds of things that end up on counters - from charts or clipboards, to stethoscopes, etc. For ambulance crews, in continuing ed things - we get lots of notices in the professional journals, etc - they're reminding us not just the handwashing thing, but also to remember to wipe your duty shoes off with the special wipes. I'm sure that personally I and my crewmates likely wash our hands anywhere from 20-50 times in a 4 hour shift at the hospital. And in my 12 hour shifts it's got to be lots more - for real, after every patient contact. And with some before. There is some thinking taught that doctors or caregivers should wash their hands when they enter to do an exam - that way the patient is assured it's been done. I know a bunch that do that - while doing the introductory talk. Self included in the hospital. On the ambulance it's not an issue. We joke that you can tell the not normally EMS types - as in when police or guys from the engine help - they've always got gloves on before doing anything - even seeing a patient. Because of all the latex allergies - it's better not to glove unless it's needed.

Health care practitioners nowadays probably wash their hands close to 2 orders of magnitude more than they did 10-15-20 years ago. With the abundance of handwashing stations all over a hospital or clinic, the new rules about availability of such, and the constant reminders to do suc - that's not the problem.

But it is true - hospitals by nature have a lot of things going on in them. But, diseases that are virulently contagious in air tend to be contained in quarantine areas with double sets of doors, and all the caregivers having to gown/mask in disposable stuff that doesn't come out into the general traffic areas.

Personally, I'm going through more hand cream this winter than I care to think about - all that handwashing ;^)

ellice

While it's true that hospitals are making progress and installing improved technology and procedures, and the best hospitals are making significant improvements in actually controlling the spread of infections through consistent and effective hand washing, study after study after study shows that lack of effective hand washing is a serious problem in many US hospitals and is one of the largest contributors to nosocomial infections.

Best wishes, Ericka