Rice grains in walls of porcelain bowls

I am interested in the techniques used to put grains of rice into the walls of porcelain bowls.

Are the bowls thrown or slip cast?

At which stage of the procedure is the rice inserted?

Must the wall be as thin as the rice is thick so that it is exposed on both sides?

Once the rice has burnt out there will be a hole left. How is this filled?

Does anyone have any good websites or books on the subject that they can recommend?

Many thanks Ken

Reply to
KSL
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i think that method is from rice wedged into the claybody. throw as usual, and lt the rice burn out. i want to do similar with saw dust one of these days. i know another potter who does sculpture that way. it makes a lighter then usual final piece since the organics burn out.

i can't imagine the casting method pulling this off?

see ya

steve

Reply to
slgraber

I have a commercial chinese rice bowl with the rice in it. It is porcelain and so tranlucent, then the rice has been put around the bowl in a very uniform way, so it is not thrown. There appears to be a very thin coating of porcelain still. I guess it is pressed in at leather hard stage? Good luck and let us know how it goes

Reply to
annemarie

I also would like to know more about this technique. My wife has a couple of pieces of "rice china". The body is opaque white, but the "rice" is translucent. My initial assumption was like yours, that they embedded rice grains and let them burn out, then filled the holes with something. But now I'm starting to have my doubts. First off, I have heard that embedded rice can be a problem: The clay is trying to shrink as it dries, and the rice is trying to expand as it absorbs water, so there could be cracking. (Maybe they used wet cooked rice?)

But also, on close inspection the "rice" spots don't look exactly like real rice grains. So now I'm wondering if they just mix up some translucent (added flux?) clay and embed little grain-shaped pieces in the ware somehow.

Or, if they do use some sort of burn-out method, maybe they pack the holes with a very thick (at cone) translucent glaze before they coat the whole ware.

My wife's pieces are from her grandmother, probably

1930s, or maybe earlier. Does anyone know of more modern work? My guess was that this might have been a fad at a particular point in time.

Inquiring minds want to know!

Best regards,

Bob Masta dqatechATdaqartaDOTcom D A Q A R T A Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis

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Reply to
Bob Masta

A quick google brought up a few hits:

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bowl is gorgeous!
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Rice-grain porcelain (translucence by carving holes)Also,
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than that, I can't find. Maybe there is another term for it? Marianne

Reply to
Bubbles

there's also that method where they'd use lace & coat it with porcelain slip & burn up the lace. "little" pices so the difference between wet & dry shrink isn't much.

~ also on that list of things to try....

i helped someone do this with cheese cloth to confirm we can actually do it, then the other student was going to try something more involved. never finished it though.

sure makes a delicate pot! the idea of using an open cloth, coated, and formed inside a bowl would make an interesting pot!

see ya

steve

Reply to
slgraber

Bob, could we maybe see some pictures of your pieces?

Lori

Reply to
Lori

One thing i tried with the kids who pot here is, to press alphabeth noodles into the soft clay and let them burn out. They had great fun with this. We then filled the letters with cobalt, wiped off the excess and glazed over it.

monika

Reply to
Monika Schleidt

Thanks for the links. Like you, when I did my search a few months ago I never could find a very detailed description. But the link that defined it as "carved" may be a clue. Perhaps some workers used actual rice as a burn-out, while others carved lacy holes, with the unifying feature being the way they got the holes to fill in with glaze or whatever.

Best regards,

Bob Masta dqatechATdaqartaDOTcom D A Q A R T A Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis

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Reply to
Bob Masta

Lori, I'll have to ask my wife to dig these out from her "Grandma-ware" collection and see if I can take a good close-up photo that shows the rice features. I'll post a link here when I do.

Best regards,

Bob Masta dqatechATdaqartaDOTcom D A Q A R T A Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis

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Home of DaqGen, the FREEWARE signal generator

Reply to
Bob Masta

Yes - the bowl is quite a bit larger. Here is the original site

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gives the measurements.> Thanks for the links. Like you, when I did my search a few> months ago I never could find a very detailed description.> But the link that defined it as "carved" may be a clue.> Perhaps some workers used actual rice as a burn-out, while> others carved lacy holes, with the unifying feature being> the way they got the holes to fill in with glaze or whatever. I had a look through the few pottery books I have, but I am a beginner and most of them are on more basic techniques.

I tried searching for "rice grain technique" and "rice grain effect", without getting any more joy from that too. Amazing how little info there is about this on the net! I suspect it is called something else more correctly.

Marianne

Reply to
Bubbles

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Look under

porcelain "rice grain" technique

The Rice Grain Pattern

No account of the various standard patterns developed to cater for the western love of the oriental would be complete without the last stroke of the Chinese genius - the Rice Grain Pattern. By the end of the Ming dynasty, a kind of pieces appeared that was called "Linglung" or "Devils work". It was porcelain pieces with its walls pierced in intricate patterns. These were very expensive and are known to have been fitted in gold and silver when in Europe. By the mid 19th century the "Linglung" design was revived in an inventive new way. By filling the pierced holes with translucent glaze one arrived at an interesting compromise combining as it did both the mysteries of Asia - "how they possibly could have fitted rice grains into the porcelain" - and a somewhat more useful bowl that better could stand the perils of trade and transportation.

Reply to
DKat

"Decorations depending exclusively on light or shape for its effect, such as carving, incising, cutting, engraving and applications et cetera are rare in modern wares. A version of the traditional pierced linglung (devils work) decoration has become a standard issue in modern Chinese porcelains, i.e. "rice grain" decoration. It is quite interesting to see how this is made by piercing holes in the thick walled "rough" pieces, how the holes are filled with transparent glaze and the piece is finally turned to its final thickness on a lathe."

So now the second part of the puzzle - what they fill the holes with - is solved.... it was/is transparent glaze - and then lathe turning (I suppose before firing - or maybe they do 2 glaze firings?).

Marianne

Reply to
Bubbles

To all who have replied - thank you!

I actually asked the question on behalf of my sister who is currently starting to experiment with porcelain work. I am, however, also interested in the subject and have found the responses extremely interesting.

Many thanks Ken

Reply to
KSL

I know this is a little late, but I have been away for a few days. Here is a link to a shot of the rice china pieces:

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It's a little over 100K in size, in case you are on a dial-up. There is no web page or other link to this photo. I'll probably take it down after a few weeks or so.

I tried to show the translucency as well as the surface. The "rice" in the rear piece is round, as though the rice grains were on end. The foreground piece is more rice-like, but still not like true rice, which is why I suspected it was not really done by burn-out. The rice spots are slightly indented on both sides of the piece, as though the melting glaze pulled itself in via surface tension.

I have no idea if these two pieces really belong together. The little bowl is 3.25 inches across and says only "China" on the bottom, while the cut-out saucer is 4.25 inches and has no identification. The bowl does seem to fit in the cut-out fairly well. Anyone know if there is a proper name for this cut-out piece, or why they made it that way?

Best regards,

Bob Masta dqatechATdaqartaDOTcom D A Q A R T A Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis

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Home of DaqGen, the FREEWARE signal generator

Reply to
Bob Masta

Very good picture, especially of the front bowl - translucency is so clear. I wonder if it would be possible to use this technique with normal clay???

Marianne

Reply to
Bubbles

Thanks. I think the main issue of using this with other clays may revolve around wall thickness. The walls may need to be very thin for the clear glaze to stay in place by surface tension (if I am right that it works that way). Might be fun to experiment with!

Best regards,

Bob Masta dqatechATdaqartaDOTcom D A Q A R T A Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis

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Home of DaqGen, the FREEWARE signal generator

Reply to
Bob Masta

Bob,

I've been otherwise occupied myself - end of semester, commencement, all the other stuff that hits this time of year......

These are very intriguing - I guess you know I'm going to have to put this into my "Gotta Try THIS!!" file.

My 'boss', good friend and partner in crime (don't anyone tell him I said that!) described a bowl like this some time ago. His suggestion was that the grains of rice were embedded when the clay was soft leatherhard - just enough to leave an impression such as this and just deep enough that they'd drop out while the clay was drying and shrinking. The impression would have been well defined at that point.

The bowl he described didn't actually have the impression all the way through the wall of the bowl - it was just a deep impression - like a stamp.

I wonder if the small, round indents were maybe just the end of the rice grain used as a 'texturing tool' or something similar to imitate it?

They're wonderful! Thank you for letting us take a look.

Lori

Life is a work of art, Created by the one who lives it.

Reply to
Lori

That's the case for the pieces in the photo as well. I would worry about actually embedding rice grains all the way through the wall to produce this, since they certainly won't pop out like in the pieces Lori mentions. I'd think they wouldn't contract as fast as the clay when drying, and would cause cracking. Maybe wet cooked rice? But I suspect they may just fake them with a pin tool.

Best regards,

Bob Masta dqatechATdaqartaDOTcom D A Q A R T A Data AcQuisition And Real-Time Analysis

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Home of DaqGen, the FREEWARE signal generator

Reply to
Bob Masta

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