Replacing bra shelf foam with horsehair?

On the other hand, my bras are fabric entirely, save for elastic at the bottom. And I'm thinking of changing from boxer-shorts elastic to three rows of quarter-inch elastic to see whether it's more comfortable.

In essence, my bras are tightly-fitted sleeveless T-shirts with elastic under the breasts -- but I find that woven linen cut on the bias gives better support than knit fabric -- and it's more predictable; I had to re-tweak the pattern for every batch of knit.

I find a bra quite essential when I'm up and walking around, but when I'm reading usenet on a hot evening I'll abandon my wet bra in favor of tucking the front of my shirt into the sweaty overlap. (All my slopping-around shirts are linen or much-washed 100% cotton, so they make fairly decent towels.)

Joy Beeson

I'm sorry, I was not aware that yours was the only opinion being solicited. When we say that a bra gives uplift,

No, that wasn't obvious at all from the post to which I was replying. You made a flat statement with no qualifyers.

Olwyn Mary in New Orleans.

I just love those ideas! It's very much more in the corset vein except with modern materials and no bones. And I have pondered a similar bolero type affair, w/o the sleeves of course, for leisure and night wear.

I do appreciate the clarification. :) I'd hoped you were just kidding.

Good thinking! I've been cogitating along similar lines but with ridgelene or, preferably, some of the other, softer synthetic boning. The German plastic bones are quite good. Farthingales has them and other synthetic boning:

I'm used to thinking in terms of spring steel because that's what you use almost exclusively for corsets. I guess that's why I didn't think of the synthetics before.

Plastic does give some support but rigidity is the problem. For awhile there, lots of bras were being made with plastic underwires but they mostly stopped because they break so much. I've retired scores of such bras to the broken-plastic-wire-cemetery. ;) For F cups+, you get far more rigidity with a thin steel wire than with any similarly sized plastic. Nonetheless, I suspect that plastic boning does have some possibilities for improving the larger-cup bras.

I was recently bra hunting and I looked at the Freyas online, especially the balcony bras. They are indeed beautiful and they even have them in my size which is amazing. What deterred me was that I have very narrow shoulders (and ribcage... I'm usually looking at a 34H) and they seemed to have a very wide strap placement. Our local bra & corset shop does not yet carry them. Alas. Are they as wide at the shoulders as they seem? And the other thing is that the straps are all so narrow. A really great bra does not depend much on the straps for support but I cannot tell just from pictures. So your experience would be helpful.

Phae

You hit the nail on the head! They "grade" bras just like they grade patterns--- stupidly for the most part. But, being the outspoken, intelligent and creative women that we all are, we are gonna change that!!! We're all gonna open our windows and yell, "I'm just not gonna take it anymore!" ........ uh......well, that works well in a fantasy anyway. ;)

Oh now that would be interesting.

Phae

I have very sloping shoulders and the straps stay on just fine. They seem to be in the same place as most of my other bras - at least, I haven't noticed a difference. I tried slipping the strap down to see what difference it made: the cup wrinkled because it was no longer under tension but didn't sag much.

As for them being narrow: no more so than others. I've just measured one and it's 5/8" wide, nice heavy satiny elastic.

I like them because they fit me on the cup and the underwires are close together at CF. Other makes are pretty but they just don't fit as well.

Sally

i'm about a 38H and i have a 36JJ in a freya and although the cups fit perfectly the straps are so wide spaced that they dig painfully into my arms. i wouldn;t call them narrow though. emma

Thanks for letting me know, Emma. I can cross those off my list. They sure look widely spaced in all the pictures too. Believe me, I know about pain and aggravation from ill-fitting bras. My shoulders have permanent grooves from effing bra straps. So I kinda like wide straps now. My Fantasie Lily's straps are 26 mm and my Rosa Faia's are 32 mm. While neither bra is perfect, the straps are quite comfortable.

Phae

Thanks for the info!

Yes, I've been ordering from Bravissimo since nearly their inception. Would you believe I've never kept any of the items? For example, the Panache tankini tops -- what G-cup woman wants straps that narrow? And the tailored shirts for curvy women are too long for my 4' 11" figure. Sally,

Yes, I have some Freya bras. I adore their style, but am a little unsatisfied with the support so far. The rounded balcony style you mentioned doesn't suit me for some reason, regardless of brand. Simply Me makes those in quite an extended size range, which is great for the

Yes, the person I'm doing this for does prefer a more revealing bra. It would be a great achievement to create a comfy, supportive and well-fitting bra with a plunge neckline for someone of her dimensions. If I can get the first three items done well, I'd certainly play with the neckline too.

As industry articles are telling us, the small band-big cup market is growing rapidly. A sorely underserved group here in the states. You Brits have so many brands that start at 30 band. Let's not even bring up VS...

It took me, uh, 25 years to discover that my proportions are different than commercial bra makers design for. What a revelation it was to discover that my perfect fit could be achieved by buying the proper cup size and then shortening the band in back. It's true at any weight and size. For my proper band size, the wires are just too narrow.

I've been working on the "Fullest Figure" section of my website. Yep, that Triumph Doreen *wishes* it was your father's oldsmobile. Berdita, Ulla and Simply Me are doing so much better. Someone just told me that Ulla goes all the way to 56J, but I haven't found that. If so my 48J should be in luck.

I did a test wire for my friend last night and compared it with the English wire charts. She would need something like a 58 or 60 wire. Beverly Johnson says that the manufacturers list the number for it but don't actually manufacture it, maxing out at 54. I've ordered some flexible spiral steel boning to see what I can make happen. (The hardware store guy suggests I temper it over a gas stove to achieve a permanent curve, but I suspect it won't be flexible enough then. Sigh...)

Wide strap placement aside, the Freyas tend toward a rounder, more "natural" breast shape for their youngish market. For me that means a bit saggy in the bottom cup. Definitely not as supportive as Fantasie. Young Attitude also has this attribute.

Pora

I think I'll get some just for experimenting. I wonder how flat it is.

My thoughts about the reinforced flat felled seams were inspired by that Freya bra, the Tallulah full cup. It's one of the ones Oprah raved about. The bottom cup is made of a net-based lace backed with denier tricot and it's got 3 of these flat-felled type seams running vertically. They are impressively stiff enough to keep the lace from crumpling down but are quite flat. Combined with the steel underwire it's achieving the necessary shaping with minimal fabric. One might increase the rigidity even more by including organza or stiff net in the seam (not the whole panel).

Pora

I haven't forgotten about your need for lower underwires. I have a plunge bra like the one in the Ezi-Sew picture and out of curiosity measured the wire. It was a metric 105. The wire in my regular bra is a 95. I don't know if there is a rule to be derived from this. I posted a comment asking about this on Beverly Johnson's blog. We'll see if there's anything to learn. But for your sake, I still seems like a good idea to simply lower the neckline on your best-fitting bra and snip the wires. You can leave it fully banded and get pretty good stability. What are your thoughts on this?

Pora

By the way, I did recently try out a high-end shop and walked away with a few from Prima Donna. They're the full figure part of a family of Belgian luxury collections by Marie Jo (similar to Rigby and Peller). I subsequently bought more from Marie Jo's other lines and have gotten a better idea of how they achieve their high-end look and feel. The fabrics of course are better, but they clearly strive to make the bras light in weight. For example, the side shaping power bar in the embroidered stretch net bra is made of tulle. I would never have thought to do that and it is absolutely invisible. I was shocked to find it. Their cup linings aren't tricot but ultrafine mesh. Stretch or non-stretch as appropriate. Although the tulles and meshes aren't so *very* comfy as tricot, the superior fit, fabrication, construction, lightness and style keep me coming back to those bras. I think the definition of elegance is achieving the most result with the least effort. Compared with the overkill of heavy layers and foams in other fuller-figure bras, this approach is inspirational. I'd say that's what's gotten me so fired up in this 48J project.

I give you so much credit for pursuing this, Pora! Since women gave up their steel-bone corsets for the building of battleships, there has been little meaningful study of what's actually good for women insofar as supportive foundations are concerned. I fear most of the emphasis has been geared toward what makes women appear sexier--- no matter how uncomfortable, gauche or stupid. I think these discussions are really helpful and productive. :) And I agree that the industry has also done little to exploit new materials and methods either.

Phae

i'm going to say i've alswyas been unimpressed with bravissiimo. the few times i've been int to the shops, they've had less than 5 bras in my size andf when i was measured thety didn;t even get out a tape measure, just looked me up an down. Up to a 38G the do have soem interesting ones but if you're looking for functional up to that size Asda/tesco/M$S are worth a try. Above a G Bravissimo doesn't seem to have much that isn't avaibale elsewhere. And the strappy tops- nice idea. horible construction. emma

A good fitter doesn't always need a tape. Most can asses you without one. It's like me not having to take a tape measure to get a good idea of what size pattern to buy for you... :) After many years of doing it, you know...