When the student is ready the teacher appears

I've got two - one major and one - well we'll see how it turns out.

The most significant break through - for me - was Peter Pipe

- of East Bay Woodturners - grinding a curve on my 3/4" skew

-AND showing me how to do it. THAT changed my view of a skew

- from a scary tool - to my favorite tool - and opened up all kinds of possibilities - which I'm still exploring. Now I'm fearless (but not reckless) with skews and can do more with it than the tool rack full of other turning tools.

The second breakthrough was my recent plunge into turning small - really small - as in 0.02" diameter - in poplar. I'm trying cuts I woudln't even consider trying on something anything bigger than maybe 3/4" in diameter. When turning small, the worse that can happen is that a little teeny tiny piece of wood might fly off - harmlessly. And I don't even worry about a catch scaring the hell out of me. Even if things go disasterously wrong I'm only out what would otherwise be just scraps. So, because the risk is so low I'm trying techniques that will work at a larger scale. If practice makes perfect, learning on small scale pieces allows for a LOT of practice.

And because, at this scale, sanding is difficult or impossible, I can concentrate on creating shapes and forms and combinations - in

10 or 15 minutes rather than hours or daze (I tend to lose interest after 30 minutes, an hour at the most). It's kind of like doing 30 second sketches - get the important lines - leave the rest to the viewer. That got me to see The Whole instead of focusing on each element - independently.

The spin off of this second breakthrough was that I tried turning with a square end, single bevel chisel - and I mean a Buck Bros. 1/4" bench chisel and not a "real" woodturning tool - like a bedan. Hell, I'm turning the real small stuff using an old bayonet saw blade with the teeth ground off it - with a paper towel "handle" (in the third photo on this page)

charlie b

That's some really small turning, Charlie. Smaller than I have ever seen in person, that's for sure. I appreciate you taking the time to post those pics.

Quite impressive on the control of the tools.

Robert

I think there are three things that really made a difference the way I turn.

1) I went to a seminar put on by Sorby a several years ago to watch a guy demo that texture tool they sell. Woodturning wasn't what it is now, and me a 5 people were there, and the seminar/demo was free! Anyway, since he was from England, I asked him what he considered the the biggest difference in the actual turning process (not style/shape/ art, etc.) of an Englishman and an American. His answer was "speed". You told me "you guys turn a LOT slower than we do over there. I mean a lot. When I was doing demos for out bowl and spindle gouges last summer, I had shocked the crowd by turning up the lathe speeds a lot faster than they were used to."

The result was I went home and juiced it up a lot, and now rarely turn too slow anymore. It is much easier to make better cuts, better to hide out of balance vibrations (or at least deal with them), and easier to cut details.

2) When I realized that I could grind my tools to cut the way I want, and not pay attention to the accepted grinds. Some grinds are great on some tools, but I noticed not all the book and magazine grinds worked at an acceptable level on my chisels and gouges. I was thinking... man... if that just had a little longer wings on that grind (or less) or maybe a little more angle...

Then one day I thought, well why not? I change all my flatwork tools to suit me, so why not these? So I spent about a month grinding the daylights out of my chisels just changing grinds. It was liberating. I went from using a lot of tools to do different things to about 5 since they would all do what I wanted them to do. It dawned on me at that time that the nationally known turners that are linked to a certain grind most likely found their grind by the same method of grinding, cutting, regrinding, cutting, etc.

As a sidbar, I have a cheapie tool that was sold as a 3/8 spindle gouge that is neither fish nor fowl. It is too wide to be a good spindle gouge and the flute is too deep. The flute is not deep enough to be a good heavy duty bowl gouge. But with the right grind it will do great work hollowing out vases, and for finishing cuts on bowls. And I was ready to pitch that damn thing until I decided I had nothing to lose and starting grinding it in my own way. I like it so much now I ordered another one for spare!

3) Probably the most important thing was when I decided I didn't give a crap about my stuff conforming to the accepted stylings of the national turners and their legion of copy cats. I got my nose out of joint with that because I turn for fun, and only sell enough of my projects to buy more lathe stuff.

When I had enough of listening to the self appointed judges of our turning club parrot what they had heard on some woodturning show or read in Woodturning Design, I quit. They would take wonderful little project efforts and gently but quickly shred the work to pieces in front of some hopeful turner that was just looking for a small pat on the back for his efforts.

I haven't been back to the land of the critics and artists in about a year now, and don't miss anything there except a couple of the old timers that were just there to have fun.

Woodturning is fun, and should be fun. It is about the only aspect of woodworking where you can turn out a finished project in an extremely short period of time and not feel pressed. Once I remembered that I was doing this for the sheer enjoyment of simply sculpting the wood, the fun came right back.

Robert

Hi tww, Good question and some good answers.

My woodturning life (and we all need a life outside of it) was resurrected and/or changed for the better by several circumstances along the way. They not only changed the way I turn, but also why I turn. I hope this is on topic since they may not have been "a leap forward", but each kindled a rebirth in my hobby not only in better turnings, but also in the pleasure of turning them.

Running across Frank Pain's little book in a second hand bookstore, "The Practical Wood Turner", revived a previous interest long lost in work, small apartment living and family responsibilities. The advent of affordable lathes designed for bowls and spindles (for me, Nova) and minis that weren't toys (for me Carbatec) made me realize that there was more to it than candle sticks and chair stretchers. The availability of tools designed for woodturning applications (Roy child's superflute, Nova chucks, etc.) widened my hobby considerably.

What I call "Social Turning" began when a few books besides Holtzapffel (Childs, Nish) appeared and we had occasional area get-togethers to lie, drink beer and talk of woodturning. A little later on AAW, magazines, meetings, symposia and particularly RCW, which for me at least, was the grandaddy of the net groups taught me a lot technically, but more importantly revived, enlivened and maintained a previously isolated hobby.

Whether or not I've answered it, thanks for raising the question tww,

Turn to Safety, Arch Fortiter

The thing that makes me leap forward is not so much any skill or method of acquiring them, but finally making the decision not to postpone the "big &* bold" projects I had planned and dreamt of. For years I have collected prime pieces of wood and every tour through the wood pile becomes inspiring, however I have a tendency to shy away from the really spectacular ones that are difficult, fragile, will require a lot of fixturing and careful planning, usually saying to myself "I need more practice" or "I'm not quite good enough for that yet". But it can be a mistake, saving the best for last (except when eating). I deprive myself of the challenge and the thrill of living up to it, and the learning process that will take place.

Since I don't turn full time, it's easy to make those excuses, even years after the first such epiphany, however when I just dive in and do those big and bold pieces I am always rewarded so much more than I expect, I end up with a high that lasts for weeks and am awed by the final product. It's a boost to all that I am, not just woodturning, although that benefits the most.

Thanks to all of the people who passed long their experiences.

Just because I used the terms 'master' (since I was thinking of Zen at the time) and the term 'great leap forward' does not mean any 'yet-to-be masters' who reads posts in this group are disqualified from telling the rest of us what experiences causied the scales to fall away from their eyes and better techniques to appear. Enlightment may be gradual or sudden in the different Zen traditions and I assume in learning how to turn it is the same. .

The current question evolved from an earlier question I posted on how to notice torn grain before you put finish on a piece. The people who anwered that post definitely helped the scales fall away from my eyes and my bowls look much better thanks to those 'masters'.

I was lucky enough to pick up a mentor from this group, Chuck, alias "WoodChuck".. He's sent me wood, given me advice, looked at pictures of my work and told ma both what I did right and wrong..

A huge breakthrough was when he was guiding me into a little different shape on my bowls... Mine tended to have curved bases and almost straight sides, but I really hadn't noticed that..

In practicing curves that ran more smoothly from bottom to top, I had the neon sign flash in my head, saying something like: You have to cut a lot of wood off the blank to do it right"

I realized that the reason that Chuck's work flowed and mine didn't was because I was trying to get the largest diameter bowl possible from every blank.. and not "waste" wood.. If you visualize a bowl inside the average blank, you will probably see how little of the wood remains when the bowl is finished... I think my work got better and seems to sell better when I began to shape things the way I "saw" them, not the way I could get the biggest bowl out of the wood.. YMWV

mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

snip

Coming from "flat work", where 10-15% "waste" is typical, the idea of sweeping up 80-90% of what I started with seemed crazy - and so wasteful of precious wood. And like you described, newbies like me don't want to waste hard to come by stuff - especially in the sizes required for bowls and hollow forms. But after a while, once stacked piles of logettes with sealed ends have been sitting around on the driveway and tucked under the gar - make that shop - eaves for a year or so and a chainsaw was acquired, things slowly begin to change - as does the meaning of getting the best out of a chumk of wood. "Best" goes from biggest diameter to nices form to show off the wood AND end up with a pleasing shape. The term "wasted wood" changes dramatically. Making an ugly piece which "wastes" the least amount of wood is truly a total waste.

Now I'm going back to starting with what's normally waste wood, and turn 95% of it into waste. Cribbage pegs anyone?

charlie b

Well put, as usual, Charlie... That's what I was trying to say, but a much better explanation..

mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

It's kind of funny, as I was reading this and thinking about that "wasted wood," it occurred to me that woodturning is the only thing I do that I use an entirely different aestetic than anything else for. Being of Germanic stock, I have a tendancy to build everything heavy and strong- why use a bit of 14ga sheetmetal when a 1/2" steel plate will do, right? But my bowls and other lathe projects are usually an exercise in brinksmanship, where I almost always go for wood so thin it is translucent. (Not to follow any set of rules, as I'm not even entirely sure what the "rules" are, having dropped all magazine subscriptions and steadfastly refused to watch television for a long time now- I just am enchanted by the idea that wood can be thin enough to allow light to pass through it, and still be strong enough to be useful.)

I can sympathize with the "trying to get the largest diameter bowl possible from every blank," though- I wouldn't be surprised to find out that every beginning turner goes through that. Especially if your first lathe is a mini/midi, and you're trying to figure out if you can do anything that is actually big enough to be useful with the machine you just dropped $350 on.

Some great tips in response to a great question.

Here is one that is sure to bring out the "if you can smell it, it's too dangerous to use" crowd, but it sure works well for me and I choose to assume the associated risks for the benefits.

I turn a lot of Walnut wet and dry and usually end up with black hands at the end of a day in the shop. No amount of detergent or scrubbing gets it all off. I discovered that a little household bleach on a wet rag is a quick and most effective way to get clean. I then immediately wash thoroughly with detergent and warm water to get the bleach off which contains sodium hypochlorite.

This may not be advisable for people with sensitive skin or those who may feel it is an unsafe practice based upon label and/or MSDS warnings. But I spoke with a Dermatologist about it and she said that she regularly uses household bleach topically in treating certain skin infections and disorders. Her advice was in essence if it does not irritate your skin it is okay. She expressed a greater concern about the consequences of not getting the black oil off my hands. Her opinion was that the potential to develop skin problems from the wood oil, acids and whatever else may be in the "black juice," was greater than periodically using a dilute bleach mixture followed by a thorough rinsing.

It's so nice to have clean hands.

I'll second that.

A while back I was sitting in a Dentists chair, undergoing a root canal. Guess that he used to clean out the hole? Right - Sodium hypochlorite - in fact a stronger solution than typical household bleach, but in controlled amount & location....

Education is much better than unfounded fear....

NGA

Kerosine and a piece of scotchbrite works pretty well, too.

Lemon or lime juice will remove walnut "black" - smells nicer than bleach too.

Gorilla Glue, on the other hand, or sometimes on BOTH hands, requires losing the layer of skin it's attached to.

charlie b