Hollow chest pattern adjustment

Given your description of the fit issue, it seems likely that the fit and neckline level is such that you could use the same method as you use with a V neck, doing a bit of redrawing on the neckline to make the shape nice.

If this doesn't work for you, here are some ramblings. I am not professionally trained like some of the experts here, but I enjoy making clothes that fit the wearer.

It seems that this kind of fitting challenge could be caused by a few different issues, rounded back/hollow chest, larger than B cup bust or poor pattern.

If you just put the pattern piece on the fabric with bottom on the fold and the neckline 3/4" over the fold, you will loose progressively less width all the way down. You can only afford to do this if you have some extra room in the bust and a little extra room below the bust.

If you match the edge of the pattern piece to the fabric fold up to the bustline (or a bit above), then have it start to overlap up to 3/4" at the neckline, you will also need to fold a small tuck shortening the length of the center front, to make the pattern piece sit on the fabric correctly. You can test with the top you have already made and see if you can afford to give up any of the front length. You gain a bit of length by having the neckline start higher up on the curve anyway, so this may work for you.

If you can't give up any length of fabric in the front, the fit issue could be caused by a larger than B bust. In this case, you might slash the dart instead of making a tuck to allow the pattern piece to overlap the fold at the top front. This way you would end up with a wider dart. Since too large a dart may not look great, a second dart from side seam toward bust would be another option.

--Betsy

On Wed, 31 Dec 2008 10:12:33 +1100, FarmI wrote:

If I were to view you from overhead, and you were standing, looking to the right, your shoulders look more like ( than |, right? The first shape is increasingly common due to what I call "keyboard slump", but it's also sewing machine slump -- sort of the opposite of the shoulders back-chest out military posture. We're not talking about pectus excavatum, right?

keyboard slump is the issue, I have two fixes for it, one PT and onepatternmaking.

The PT fix is what I call "hanging around in doorways" -- for which you need a narrowish doorway, the ability to raise your arms to shoulder level, and some patience. A month of this exercise (which doesn't hurt but is slightly boring) will often bring the shoulders back an inch or so. Even for us old codgers.

-- the position of the stretch is shown in the second photo. Put your hands up in the "I surrender"position against a door frame. Take a step forward with one foot and feel thestretch across the upper chest at slightly above the sleeve notch positions.Hold that for 30 seconds 5-10 times a day... makes a good time to gatheryour thoughts. I've just gotten in the habit of doing the doorframe stretch every time I leave the bathroom, because the door is just the rightwidth. I do one stretch taking a step forward with the right foot, thena second one with the left foot taking the step. How much of a step? Enoughto feel a bit of stretch; not enough to feel pain. 6-9" for most folks. If you're sore the next day, take a smaller step.The patternmaking fix is to simply make up a muslin of your basic pattern,and mark the crossgrain on the upper chest and CF. Baste the side seamsand pin the shoulders. Get a friend to smooth the excess fabric in the upperchest area up and toward the point of the shoulders, keeping the center linestraight and the crossgrain straight and level. Repin the shoulder seams.The armscye is now not going to match up with the back armscye, and the frontneckline may not match either. Mark in the new shoulder seam, and unpin.Transfer the new shoulder seam markings to the pattern. Fill in the necklinewith extra tissue, as needed. Draw in the seamline on the armscye, from shoulder to side seam. Cut along the armscye seamline from shoulder line to side seam, and swing the seam allowance section over (pivoting from the sideseam/armscye intersection) to match with the back armscye position. Tapeit down and you're done. It sounds like you're making a basic pattern and you intend to change the neckline to vary it. Remember that if you drop the neckline, you will need to take a "patternmaker's pinch" out of the upper chest to compensate.

Kay

(snip)

:-)) the experts are busy drooling over books so I guess we keen amateurs might sneak a conversation under the radar without them noticing.

It's a Simplicity pattern and although I could blame the pattern, in all fairness, I think it's my odd, aging body.

Yep. I can see that and can afford to lose a bit.

Thanks for those suggestions. Ill finish off this version and then do a bit of playing around. Might cut out a few fronts using the changes you suggested and see what works out best. I can pin fit them to the back which is now fitting well since I redid the top between the neck and the shoulder blades and see how they'll look and then give the most promising a try. Who'd a thunk that such a simple item of clothing could be such a pig's ear.

:-(( Sadly, yes, but it's high up where my dowager's hump is obviously going to form in the not too distant future. Across my shoulder blades, I'm still flat.

The first shape is

In addition, I've had a radical mastectomy on one side and I dunno what they do to achieve such a result, but standing naked in front of the mirror (and ignoring the scarring) it looks like the rib cage of a starved person. Not an ounce of spare underskin fat and just bone very, very visible through the skin and this sunken, scooped look proceeds up to about 2 inches from the natural neckline on that side.

Now that's a great idea. Might adopt that as my one and only new Year's resolution.

If I understand you correctly, I'd effectively be removing the excess fabric at both the shoulder seam and the armhole? Or did I interpret you wrongly? I was lying in bed last night wondering to myself if perhaps the shoulder and armhole area were where I might get rid of the excess and then trueing up the seams.

It's not really a desire to change the neckline - it's more of a tactic to 'rescue' the garment.

This current version is made out of a bit of stash for which I had no plans so I was treating it as sacrificial if it was a total dud. In fact it will work with just to two little tucks at the neck and a newly cut neck facings to take account of less fabric at both the back because of the increased seam and the two front tucks. It's not going to be a 'Sunday best' top, but certainly good enough to wear in public and not have to hang my head in shame. :-)).

It sounds like you have several problems all warring with each other. Natural skeletal shape, posture, and extra un-evenness caused by surgery do not make for easy fitting! The surgery sounds like you lost a chunk of muscle along with the breast, which is not unusual and does lead to posture changes as well as being a fitting issue of it's own. For blouses and tops this makes life difficult, especially if you cannot manage prosthetics (and many can't after such radical surgery).

I have no more advice to add to what you have worked out here. Having had to fit a customer who had scoliosis as well as the results of both breast and shoulder surgery, I think you have done very well to make something respectable here. Be careful not to OVER fit, as getting a perfect fit for each side of the body will often emphasize the bit you least want to be noticed and exaggerate the lack of symetry.

Yup, that'll still throw the front off (and possibly the back in that area... you may want a back neck or back shoulder dart there... possibly not much more than a pintuck in size.

Yup, that's it exactly... you're removing length and width as needed, watching the grain lines so you don't wind up accidentally pulling the rest of it off. Then true shoulder and armscye, and possibly neckline. Quick tip for necklines -- a loosely fitted chain necklace with a slightly heavy pendant shows you natural sides and CF of the neckline.

I understand that!

You might want to work up a good basic pattern with a silhouette you like, and then play theme and variations with the basic pattern, rather than reworking a new pattern each time.

Oh, you did remember to check the pattern for balance, didn't you? Unbalanced patterns do strange things anyhow, without regard to the body underneath. Some of the Simplicity patterns I've looked at have been particularly bad in that regard.

Kay

>

I'll keep that in mind but at the moment, sewing the back seam with a curve in the seam line seems to have done the job for this version. I may incorporate that into the next version. I've been reading up about fitting for those with a severe dowager's hump and all sorts of other adjustments. amazing how one simple thing can lead on to so many other "what ifs".

You hit the nail on the head with that comment. That's the reason why I picked this pattern. I figured once I get this right, I can then use the pattern to vary it and could make a simple full length shift style dress or empire line dress of just make a dozen or so of these things for summer.

I don't know what you mean by that term Kay. Could you explain please? I might know it by another term but not that one.

(snip)

:-)) Yes indeed, but I'm refusing to give in and live in shapeless 'one size fits all' knit garments. I'll get a reasonable fit if it kills me.

I do wear a prosthesis (aka 'chicken fillet') if I go out in public but it's heavy and uncomfortable and I ditch it whenever I know I'm going to be at home all day and unlikely to have unexpected visitors. One advantage of living in the country with no neighbours within a km.

I've found that very small shoulder pads works well for winter stuff, but I can't do that for a sleeveless garment to be worn when the temperature reaches over the old century.

Thank you. I had quietly thought the same thing myself given how unpromising it looked at a first try on, but then I realised that in my youth, such a simple garment would have been something I could have whizzed up with so little thought and effort. That was not a fun thought. Getting old is not for the faint of heart.

Be careful not to OVER fit, as getting a

:-)) At my age and stage, overfitted is not what my body screams out for. I just want something that is going to look halfway decent, made out of woven fabric which lets me survive mid summer and can be thrown in the washing machine. Any RTW business that comes up with such a simple garment (or a line of garments like that) will have my business, but such a simple thing seems to have escaped the notice of 'fashion' buyers.

I have found things that fit that description - though may or may not be what you have in mind - at Vermont Country Store's web site. Probably not a viable source for you - you're in the U.K.? I notice a lot of their things are made in India. I choose woven cottons, washable, and have gotten lots of compliments on them. What I want is some patterns to make up some like them in the fabrics I have in my stash. An example:

Mine is green. ;-)

No, I'm in Australia.

I notice a lot of

:-)) When you find those patterns, perhaps we can share them as that's exactly what I'm after too.

But I do think there are in reality patterns very similar to them out there in pattern land. It's just getting them made up and with a good fit that is the problem.

An example:

Very nice and there are some really good ideas on that site. I've bookmarked it for a better look when I get back to broadband.

I've searched for patterns, and not found anything. Not that it's impossible, but I just haven't seen them. I'm almost to the point of trying to trace off some patterns. My closet is full of Vermont Country Store things, and I've been really pleased with them. They're not the cheapest available, but the quality is much better than the alternatives I've found.

Recently I lost a button from a dress that I've had for several years. It may have come with a spare, but I can't find it. I wrote to them to see if they could send me a button (the dress is still available from them), and they replied to say that they didn't have a button, but I could return the dress for a replacement!! I was tempted, but I've worn that dress and washed it so many times, and certainly got my money's worth, so I thanked them and said I would make do.

There are some formal pattern balances that seem to be taught mostly within the ready to wear industry, but not in home patternmaking. They help keep the pattern correctly positioned on your body. If you've had a blouse pattern that does the maternity top swing, you've had a pattern that probably wasn't balanced in the side seam -- you had two warring grainlines in the seamline. Looks like the first photo here, although that pattern also has an atrocious armscye: (look at it in relationship to the side seam on the mannequin):

how it's about an inch ahead? This is also one of the patterns thatwould ride up and strangle you in the front neck, while doing the Japanese courtier kimono descending back neckline thing... or it would,if you could get your arm through that armhole, which is both too tight andunbalanced. The first photo was of the pattern pinned on their seam lines. The blue lines were the correction lines added later.

There were four major changes made to the pattern:

1) side seam was balanced (fourth picture) and the seam now sits on the side seam of the mannequin 2) armscye was enlarged and balanced 3) front fisheye dart removed because it was off the bust point and there was virtually no ease in the pattern anyhow. 4) shoulder seam balanced

One more change should have been made, and that was to actually fix the front side seam and back side seam lengths to be equal.

I don't have pictures of it, but the sleeve, if you pinned it into the armscye, actually hung behind the body

The original armscye actually came to a point under the arm... that would have been fun, too.

I'll stick up some stuff about pattern balance in a separate post.

What styles are you looking for? I know I have a few patterns in my collection that are very similar to some of the styles I saw there.

Tha't extremely good service. They're well worth being a repeat buy if they offer such a service.

This is also one of the patterns that

Interesting pics there. Thanks for that.

That's the 100% guarantee. Vermont Country Store offers that, and L.L. Bean does, too.