Long Tail Cast On --- WHY??

"This creates a nice, stretchy edge that works well for stockinette stitch or for ribbing. Easy to knit from, easy to pick up stitches from, this is also the fastest cast-on I know, once you get the hang of it. It's even faster than Single Cast-On when you take into account that this method creates an already knitted row."

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sue

It can be the same size, if you do it loosely enough, but I think it makes that first row backwards. I still like it. It makes a good solid start to the knitting. I don't find it as stretchy as some do, but that's also a matter of how you do it.

=Tamar

Why isn't it true? If I design a sweater pattern I might say:

"Cast on 300 using the long-tail method. Next row is a right-side row."

Why would I do that? I want the purl bumps inherent in a long-tail cast-on to be a design element. It isn't true or untrue - it's how I designed the sweater.

That's a fault of the pattern designer and/or the pattern editor and has nothing to do with the cast-on. The designer's job is to produce a garment with some sort of instructions for reproducing same; the editor's job is to turn the designer's chicken-scratch into instructions usable by your average "must have a pattern to follow" knitter. If the instructions are unclear or the knitter inexperienced then confusion will ensue, but don't blame the cast-on for that.

Indeed.

Were you to make a backward loop cast on and then knit those loops you'd end up with a smaller (in the sense of less wide as well as tighter), less-flexible edge than were you to make a "standard" long-tail cast-on. Why? Because as you knit the loops the loops tighten up, you take the slack up into the next loop, and the next, and the next as you work across the cast on. Eventually you work several inches (or feet, if you're casting on something big like an afghan) out of the cast-on edge and into the tail.

With practice and concentration one's long-tail cast-on row can in fact be made at exactly the same gauge as the rest of the project.

Mine is pretty stretchy, but it's pretty individual too.

I just really get annoyed when How To directions for it say `this CO makes a row of knitting so you should start your pattern on the WS row' or something to that effect. This is so not true and really confuses beginners because they think they shouldn't do R 1 or that they should count the CO as a `row' when knitting X for 10 rows or something. It's a CO, not a row and it's not necessary to with R2. After a person has some experience they can decide what looks better to them in a particular pattern.

sue

Actually, I think the long tail cast on is THE fast and easy way to achieve a starting row that is the correct gauge. That is; that good long tail cast on takes less practice and concentration to get good results than other methods.

Where I have to cast on a bunch of stitches, I will sometimes use a another piece of yarn tied to my working needle so that I can do a long tailed cast on within the field of fabric, rather than just using a backward loop cast on.

Aaron

Perhaps you should cast on with larger needles than you need and then change? madelaine

As I said, an experienced knitter can decide how to incorporate the bumps into the pattern, but a newbie may not understand that. But very few patterns even mention things like which CO to use and what to do on the first row.

I don't blame the cast on method at all, just the instructions for doing it.

sue

Interesting... I've been using it for years and years and find that it's much smaller than the rest of my knitting. If I were to use much smaller needles than I do, it may be closer to the same gauge.

sue

Yep, it seems a majority knitters use that most of the time.

That's another good tip/trick if you need to cast on lots and lots of stitches.

sue

Then the CO would be much too loose. I'm not talking about the stitches it produces, but the actual CO where the loops tighten up around the stitches. Maybe Wooly didn't mean that and I misunderstood.

Where she originally wrote: >>> Were you to make a backward loop cast on and then knit those loops >>> you'd end up with a smaller (in the sense of less wide as well as >>> tighter), less-flexible edge than were you to make a "standard" >>> long-tail cast-on. Why? Because as you knit the loops the loops >>> tighten up, you take the slack up into the next loop, and the next, >>> and the next as you work across the cast on.

I thought she meant that the thumb loop in a longtail that is similar to the backwards loop CO could be made the same gauge, but I think now she didn't.

sue

No, I meant what I said: a backwards loop cast on produces a narrower, tighter cast-on than a long-tail due to the mechanics of the first row of knitting.

The backwards loop produces a bunch of slack after each loop is knitted off; the knitter can either work the slack back into the knitting or work it out altogether.

A long-tail cast-on avoids this problem because one is simultaneously casting up the loops *and* knitting them. One has much better control over the finished size of the foundation loops as a result.

I must be doing the backward loop wrong or ??? differently. I find with mine, there is so much loose stuff that I have no trouble with a less flexible edge. I've only just recently tried the backward loop on socks and found it to be fine (once I got used to it). I dunno, I guess I'd have to use it a few more times to be able to have much of an opinion on it. Any thoughts?

Shelagh

I do not think that there is a sample of a backward loop cast on in my house. They have all been either frogged or tossed. I can not do a backward loop cast on that I like.

Aaron

I use a long-tail for several reasons. One is that I'm very picky about which side of the cast-on is the front row. With some patterns one will look better, and with another pattern the other will look better. And I always keep consistent so the pieces all match at the bottom. Second, it drives me crazy to run out of yarn as I'm casting on, and this prevents that problem. Finally, I like having the extra tail! I try to leave about 3 feet extra, and then I just coil it up loosely and hold it out of the way with a safety pin. That gives me my thread for the sewing-up!

Okay, I misunderstood what you said. I've never trouble with the LT co tension either.

sue