I, too, regret whatever fuel I added to the recent fire on this ng and I am thankful of yours and other's willingness to quench it. "Manners Maketh Man" on both sides of the pond ....and everywhere else on earth. I can't find the article in 'Woodturning' about your fine collection and the wonderful support you two gave to the art of woodturning. but I am glad to know that it continues. I do remember reading that neither of you were knowledgeable or much interested in the craft, but bought pieces that you liked from turners with whom you got on well.
If you haven't become too 'craft savvy' ;), having been exposed to the best of worldwide craftsmen-artists, your participation in rcw threads or as essays from a knowledgeable collector's perspective would be very welcome. Consider using this multi-national group as a platform for your approach. A strong but different leg of what I call the "wood art triad" would be unique and a real plus for this ng.
No one can guarantee reasoned responses on an unmoderated forum, but please don't reject my sincere invitaton out of hand.
You will always be welcome at my house and on this ng.
It was sad to see the amount of goodwill wasted in the earlier thread and I hope that this board does not fall into an inflamatory, insult driven machine!
There are very few people who have amassed works on the scale of the "Daniel Collection." I would only hope that their interest in American works have not been tempered by the reception Jonathon received here.
I second your invitation and look forward to reading additional posts from Jonathon about their effort in the future.
Thanks Lyn, That's the article. I think it should indemnify anyone concerned about the consequences should Jonathan agree to pitch in. Do you and others here welcome him or not?
I'm no pollyanna and I'm not condoning nor condemning anybody, but rcw has survived many flaming threads and often the worst posters have become (or resumed being) useful and reasoned contributors to rcw. You are probably thinking; "takes one to know one." :)
His childish remarks welcomed him to my killfile several days ago, and there he will stay. He and Mr. Kyder can have a fine old time in there, and I'll be just as happy not to see their delightful discussions.
Arch, I've known Jonathon for a long time, though we have corresponded only intermittently. All my earlier correspondence from him was most gentlemanly and congenial.
I think he has been very generous towards all who are involved with woodturned art. To the artist he has supported their artistry, both directly through his (and Shirley's) purchases and indirectly by generating greater attention for their work; to the larger body of active woodturners, he has offered views of work that can broaden our perspectives and provide inspiration; to those who only passively appreciate woodturned art, he and Shirley allow us an opportunity to view beautiful and stimulating pieces, some of which are not readily available for viewing outside England. He does this all at his and Shirley's own expense. Obviously he could be content to do this for Shirley and himself alone (indeed, his insurance company might have prefered he was less visible about his collection), but instead he and Shirley choose to expend their own funds to create and maintain a means for others to appreciate and learn from their collection.
So, I admire their generosity, and enjoy looking through their growing collection, just as I did when they first started out and had fewer pieces to share. I must confess I do find the scrolling a little awkward, but that is really a most trivial thing in the context of the great value and enjoyment all the other aspects of the site afford.
We all have times when we just don't feel like passively absorbing one more whit of what seems to be ingratitude or abuse (which may or may not be legitimately the case, but still seems real to onself) Obviously this was his time and I know I have had my own moments. At those times, it is easy to loose sight of the larger effects of our actions when we are trying to not let prevail what we percieve to be the verbal bullies. Again, I've been there (I didn't earn that COC for "nuthin"), and of course, without any greater success in the enterprise.
In a moderated forum, it is unlikely the harshness of the earlier threads would have been allowed to develop or remain in the way that it has here. Again, one of the reasons I spend most of my time at the Wood Central Turning forum. But most here move on and respond to each new post on its own merit. I suspect this will be the course of things again.
Jonathon is in no wise beholden to me. I began with a reasoned critique of the sort I believe he intended to invite and he responded well to it. Later, as things got testicular, I let my emotions get out of hand and he responded in kind. I consider us even, having each spoken rashly enough to shame the better men we can be. I accept his apology and tender my own for much the same reasons he tendered his.
IMHO, the first critique he received was inflammatory, provocative and not well grounded in facts. His response fanned the flame. Stupidly, I joined in an argument to which I was not a principle. I know better. Normally I do better. But this time I allowed myself to get sucked into someone else's fight ... um, it wasn't even much of a fight ... more of a hissing match. But I was in there spitting and hissing with the rest and for that I apologize.
I still will not publish my email address on newsgroups. However, if he so signifies, I would be plenty willing to offer it to Jonathon privately. I hide from email address harvester bots, not him. Hiding from the spam bots is a first line of defense. I have others.
I am not inclined to indulge in hand wringing. But if Jonathon wishes such, I have no objection to continued discourse. The reason I do not invite public critique of my websites is that I am fully aware that they are pathetic. His is pretty darned good.
There is code that would prevent other websites from linking to his images. Perhaps he would consider using it instead of worrying about others taking low resolution copies to use on their desktops.
Moreover, having downloaded two images of work by Mr. Mortimer before I was aware that Jonathon disapproved of the practice (and reflecting on his offer to send me higher resolution copies), I can state that the resolution already offered is sufficient for a desktop wallpaper, even though there is enough stair-stepping around hard edges that the jpeg file is obviously unsuited to high-resolution printing.
Which is fine. Having the file be unsuitable for printing closes the door on much copyright infringement. Having it unlinkable pretty much slams it shut. The big difference in having a local copy vs repeatedly returning to Jonathon's web site is that he only has to pay for me to look at it once if I stash a local copy but gets slapped with the bill for each hit if I return to it time after time (or if a popular web site links to it).
So long as I do not use the image for gain, Jonathon suffers no loss at all. He invited me to view his work and that is what I am doing with it.
One thing we should all keep in mind is that Usenet posts are 1) archived
-- your words may well outlive you and 2) searchable. For the fun of it, do a Google search on any name you have used to post with -- ever.
If Godly devotion does not call you to keep a civil keyboard, perhaps seeing a five year old irrational raving bearing your signature might.
I am monitoring both the temperature and sentiment in this thread to Arch's open invitation - both to me and to more regular contributers who may have taken offence at, let's face it, what became an exchange of words in a manner and form that you would castigate a child for.
I would be pleased to have your email and will reply in a similarly considered form to you personally. Much of what I will say is not for public disection (you have no fears here Arch & Lyn) and may even put matters back on an even footing for the pair of us.
As to future participation in this particular group - I have no strong views either way as things currently stand but have noted with gratitude the kind comments extended.
Actually, it's no more than a little humbling for me to read my earlier rantings. However, it is my sincere hope that the HR department at work never gets hold of any name I have posted under. They have too much time on their hands and know how to use Google. That would likely cross the fine line between gentle awareness of my fragile humanity and unmitigated disaster leading to directly the unemployment line.
I have been as violently rude as anyone and sometimes take delight in making people wonder if they have been insulted or not. ("He can be trusted to work well under constant supervision." "Genetics is not his strong suit.")
So, having seen my stupidity in print already, I try to keep in mind that Usenet (now in Google's archives), never forgets a single detail.
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