Art Is Thoughtful Workmanship

I think that we all agree with Phil B., but that's about all we agree on. Clay's thread provoked some differing, but all good, takes on a supposedly forbidden subject. Happily, there are no always or never threads here, or this ng might succumb to irrelevant conformity. Consistency rarely restrains my opinions, which usually are nothing more than 'can openers', anyway.

Subject to change tomorrow, but right now my analogy: The Gettysburg Address would lose nothing if it had been written on a used envelope. The same if the . . . _ of the 5th symphony had been scrawled on a tablecloth. OTOH, David wouldn't have been much if he had been sculpted in mud instead of being released from a block of marble. In our discussions about art vs craft, exceptions abound. Like watching TV trash, we all deplore the art-craft thing while avidely joining the argument. Well, why not? Social climbers can never be high class because aspiring to be or claiming to be is an automatic disqualification. I think it might be the same with being a true artist.

Just musings (mouthings) from Chairman Know Naught. Others are allowed to differ. Arch

Fortiter,

However, keep in mind that the method of presentation for either is not the envelope or the tablecloth. Would the G. Address even be remembered had it been spoken by Aunt Bessie at the church social? Would the 5th symphony have been as successful had it been composed for kazoo?

Agreed. And I reiterate once again that the powerful and most revered art is that which exhibits the highest levels of skill with the chosen materials. Back once again to Lethaby's comments.

_____ American Association of Woodturners Cascade Woodturners Assoc., Portland, Oregon Northwest Woodturners, Tigard, Oregon _____

I've always liked the definition I heard once..."An artist is someone who makes a supply, whether of NOT there is any demand."

a craftsman might not bother.

so....I am an artist. Whether or not I am a 'good' artist is what others need to decide.

Dang! You're on to me. Rats...

...Kevin

And from a Smithsonian Magazine article about him a few years ago, the only reason he DOESN'T blow any more is that he lost an eye in an accident, and, "when one is swinging 60 lbs of red-hot glass around, one REALLY needs depth perception" as he so wisely observed. Regards Dave Mundt

Clay, Great! Thought provoking! Patty clipped this out of a newspaper for me and I have kept it and refer to it often:

"A man who works with his hands is a laborer; a man who works with his hands and his brain is a craftsman; but a man who works with his hands and his brain and his heart is an artist." Louis Nizer American lawyer (1902-1994)

I look forward to seeing you in January. Bill Sullivan Fort Myers, FL

Thanks, Bill.

That quote is pretty popular with craftsman/artists. Here are a few that may not be as familiar.

"I am enough of an artist to draw freely upon my imagination. Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world. "

-- Albert Einstein

"Skill without imagination is craftsmanship and gives us many useful objects such as wickerwork picnic baskets. Imagination without skill gives us modern art." - Tom Stoppard

"Artists can color the sky red because they know it's blue. Those of us who aren't artists must color things the way they really are or people might think we're stupid." - Jules Feiffer

"Things men and women have made with wakened hands, and put soft life into Are awake through years with transferred touch, and go on glowing for long years."

-D. H. Lawrence

This is my favorite!

Peter Teubel Milford, MA

I posted this a couple of years ago, when the same topic was up for discussion. As I see it Dale Chihuly is an artist, but he's not a craftsman.

_____________________________ IMNSHO: Art relates to the design. Craft relates to the workmanship. A piece can be fine art, fine craft, neither or both.

There are plenty of excellent craftsmen who make pieces of common design or others' design. There are also lots of artists who create original designs in crafts they haven't mastered. Obviously, it is the people who are both fine artists and craftsmen (craftspeople? crafters? craftH.Sapiens? craftcritters? craftfolk? whatever!) who are the most inspiring.

David

remove the key to email me.

What claptrap. Sour grapes, Tom? Tom is either trying to be sarcastically funny or is making a derogatory statement about artists. Picasso was a modern artist. He was also one of the best draftsman I've ever seen. He could realistically sketch an object better than just about anyone on the planet. So much for Tom's observation.