Bandsaw recommendation

You may want to do a google group search of rec.woodworking, then ask in that newsgroup if you want more info.

-- Mark

Andrew,

I am also looking to upgrade. My budget is somewhere around 1500$ and I am willing to wait if something is currently out of reach. I also use a chainsaw to maul most of the rough work. Need at least 12 inches of capacity in a saw that I will never want to upgrade.

Recommendations from the woodturners carry a lot of weight with me since we will use (abuse?) the saw in the same manner.

Thanks for this post and I'll be following it to see what kind of recommendations we get.

Kirk

Hi Andrew, In that price range Laguana would be a good choice. I don't own one but have seen them at a woodworking show. I've also read positive reviews here. I think they start at around $1000

Bob, Naugatuck Ct.

I own a Laguna 16". I just ordered my lathe so I can't comment on specific lathe related operations, but in genreal woodworking terms: I got this saw primarily because it has 12" resaw capacity in the small

16" footprint. It is very stout and the motor is plenty powerful. The mobile base they sell is great. I've done some precise resawing with it, so it _is_ capable of the kind of work it is marketed for. I think the current models come with the new 'Laguna guides' as standard equipment. This is good because [rant warning] the Euro guides, such as my saw has, truly and utterly SUCK. That more than one prototype of this design was ever built is a real blemish on the notion that mankind's collective intelligence is evolving. Either that or they are a supremely well executed cruelty joke. Did I mention that the Euro guides totally SUCK? Well they do. They suck. OK? [end rant] These guides are probably why I feel the saw is finicky and doesn't track as precisely as it should. I imagine that brute force is at least as important for roughing out something that will after be turned, and in that respect this saw is fine.

Just whatever you buy, if it has Euro guides, factor in the cost of new guides. Carter guides are around $150, and 'Laguna guides,' their new style ceramic ones, are like $220.

Peace, Sanaka

I'm not sure what the Euro guides are, but I have the Carter's on my Delta 14" - and I wouldn't recommend them to anyone who does a majority of green wood cutting. The outer surface of the bearings load up with damp sawdust and sap creating a loud and bumpy cutting experience. I frequently have to stop the saw in order to scrape the gunk off each bearing because it gets so bad. In hindsight I wish I had gone with the standard block guides.

_____ American Association of Woodturners Cascade Woodturners Assoc., Portland, Oregon Northwest Woodturners, Tigard, Oregon _____

I have a Jet 18". At first I wasn't really happy with it and REALLY wished I'd have spent twice as much for a Laguna. But after a few months of frustration I spent a few hours tuning it up. Now I'm a happier with it and only sorta wish I had a Laguna. But...for sawing out blanks & such, the Jet does a good job and cash that would've gone to Laguna is better spend on chucks & turning tools.

I'm not sure how well it would work doing precision resawing...never done any.

rr

Owen Lowe wrote:

Hi Randy. Does your Jet have roller guides or blocks? If rollers any problems with buildup cutting green wood?

See you Thursday? (There is a Cascade meeting Thurs., yes?)

_____ American Association of Woodturners Cascade Woodturners Assoc., Portland, Oregon Northwest Woodturners, Tigard, Oregon _____

Imagine your Carter guides with the bearings turned 90 deg. to how they are - that's Euro guides. They are standard on most of the Italian made fabricated frame saws like Laguna and Meber. There is necessarily a friction between the blade and the bearing surface all the time. Interesting the Carters clog up w/ green wood - I'm sure the Euros would be at least as bad. Block guides actually are very effective, the only 'complaint' being the friction with the blade - probably more an idealogical than real problem, especially with what you describe where blocks would keep the blade wiped clean :-) The Laguna guides are kind of a high tech block guide using a high heat aerospace ceramic for the blocks.

Peace, Sanaka

Ceramics are available for the Delta and Jet variety 14" saws. Got 'em on mine. They're as slick or slicker than the graphite coolblocks without the tendency to wear quickly away from cutting circle after circle.

They don't clog, but there's a danger there as well. They're so trouble-free you can forget to clean and lube your lower thrust bearing, a job I used to do each time I resquared my cool blocks.

I have been looking close at the Mini-max 16 and Laguna 16, these saws are about evenly priced. Anyone have any comparison or general information about these saws?

Bill

I would go with the Mini-Max if I was to make the choice. I can't really speak about comparisons because at the Woodshows the Laguna folks act like they are too busy to talk to ordinary people. The Mini-Max demonstrators will spend as much time as needed. I figure a company representative is just that, they represent how the company works and the quality of the product.

Stuart Johnson Red Oak, Texas

It has flat discs, the flat side is against the blade. They revolve but aren't the roller type your thinking of (I think).

NO...no meeting this month. Next one is in Jan.

rr

Owen Lowe wrote:

Oh...and...no...I haven't noticed a buildup when cutting green wood.

rr

Owen Lowe wrote:

Check out Grizzly. They have a nice selection.

Euro guides are just fine. I've used saws with Carter Guides and my Minimax has Euro Guides and the euro guides are just fine; no real need to upgrade to Carter guides if you're running a decent bandsaw.

Wet wood needs a fair amount of horsepower and a decent blade. I like to use the Timberwolf 3/8" 3tpi AS blade for cutting wet wood (i.e. bowl blanks), for resawing I like to use a 1" Lennox Trimaster carbide blade. A 1" carbide blade needs a saw that can tension 25000psi and has 20" or larger wheels. After a lot of searching I upgraded from a Jet 14" to a Minimax MM20. The MM20 has 20" throat, 15" resaw capacity, and a 4.8hp motor, it also has the beefiest frame in its class, very stout guide assembly, cast wheels, and is just a very massive machine for the money. It's made for Minimax by Centauro, which is a top maker of bandsaws. The Euroshop/Aggazzi bandsaws are probably the next best, followed by the ACM bandsaws that are imported by Bridgewood (their pro series), Felder, and Laguna. In 220V1phase,

60hz trim the stock ACM motors tend to run very hot which is why Bridgewood replaces the ACM motors with American made ones and Felder substitutes Austrian ones. Except fo the motors the saws are the same. The Bridgewood Pro is probably the best value of the ACM saws.

In the 16"-18" /$1000 range you're talking exclusively about light weight asian imports. The frames are much lighter and the guide assemblies are much less stout than the Italian welded steel frame bandsaws. One decent light weight Italian saw is the Minimax S45 which is made by Minimax but it's a bit more than the $1000 limit you've set.

One thing I've found with my Minimax MM20 is that I use it a lot for general purpose cutting that I use to do exclusively on the tablesaw. For example, for initial stock prep I like to use the bandsaw, instead of the tablesaw, for ripping. The kerf is less, feed rate is higher, and it's much safer. I also like to use the bandsaw for ripping any thick stock (say 16/4 leg stock). I find that using the carbide blade I'm able to get a very nice finish that cleans up quickly with a ROS or a quick pass over the jointer set for 1/64" cut.

I would seriously consider the Minimax MM16 or MM20 bandsaws.

Ellis Wallentine on the Wood Central forum addressed this question. What band saw to get for woodturners? And his response makes sense. He says get an old heavy duty Oliver, Tannewitz, Northfield, etc. band saw. Old and used and hopefully cheap. You want a big throat depth and big capacity under the guides and a huge motor. You don't really care if the tires are worn or the bearings are wobbly as a woodturner roughing blanks. You want horsepower and capacity to get the blank to rough shape. You just want your cut to be within a 1/4 inch or so of ideal. Accuracy isn't terribly important.

These old monster bandsaws come with 3 phase motors. So you would have to get a rotary phase converter to make 3 phase power or buy a VFD that takes 1 phase on the input side and produces 3 phase on the output side to get supply the motor. Not difficult or too costly for either of these methods. Dealers Electric and Ebay have cheap VFD.

While I agree with Russ on big-iron, I have taken a different route (while waiting on a big-iron deal to appear locally) due to parts availablity. I have a Reliant DD90 (14" import) that I've made some mods to that has improved the performance immeasurably. The upper wheel hinge broke, so I made one from a 1/2" thick steel plate using only a sawsall, drill press and angle grinder. It no longer a weak point in the system. I built a large table to handle big stock. Slides on and off easily (for changing blades only). I also replaced the burned out 1750 RPM 3/4hp motor with a Delta 3450 RPM

1.5hp motor. Using the existing jackshaft, I was able to get the speed down a bit. Using a 3/8" 3TPI hook tooth blade running at 4200 SFM, I can cut thru 11" thick green work with ease. The blade will break before the saw will stall (DAMHIK). This saw can't cut a straight line to save itself, but great for roughing out blanks. In fact, I just got another DD90 (free) for parts.

Peter Teubel Milford, MA

RPM 3/4hp motor...

Good move! I once borrowed a friend's Reliant when my ancient Sears (King-Seely) needed new guides and tried to resaw a piece of wenge less than

3 inches thick. Fed it very slowly, and still burned out the motor before I'd gotten through 8 inches of cut length. It convinced me not to buy one. Or much of anything else under that brand name. Not that there was much chance to begin with.

Owen Davies