Question for pen turners

On questions 1-3, I have used Penn State's mandrel and bushings exclusively and had no fit problems. It isn't that I am sure that Penn State is the best, but they have the stuff I want and they are convenient. I turn strictly for myself and friends so I may not do enough volume to be a good source, but I have used 6 or more different kits. My favorite is the fountain pen because that is what I write with.

NoOne N Particular wrote in news:UlvUh.15155$ snipped-for-privacy@newssvr13.news.prodigy.net:

I also use the Penn State mandrel and bushings and have no problems. My problem with fit on the mandrel usually comes with the pen tube and then a small rat tail files solves that quickly. My supplier of choice is Woodturningz.com. The service great and the prices right. From what I've read here, not a lot of pens get sold by the every day hobbyist-turner. I might be wrong, but that was the general flavor I understood. You may want to try penturners.org for a more focused group of folks. I get there evey so often and am amazed at the quality and creativity of the folks.

Good luck Karl

Out of the 15-ish pens/pencils that I have made so far, my favorite is also a fountain pen. I don't know why I like fountain pens so much because I hardly ever actually use one. I would say that 99% of my writing is done with a pencil, and I have two blue Pentels with .7mm leads that I have had for a good many years now.

But thanks for the info about the PSI mandrel. If I ever decide I just HAVE to have another one I'll check it out.

Wayne

Thanks for the tips. I just went over to Woodturningz.com and just took a quick look. It seems like their selection of pen kits is somewhat limited compared to someplace like Berea, but the prices looked good for what they do have.

As for penturners.org, some of those guys are just nuckin futz! Some of their stuff is just unbelievable. Some of those pens look like they took hundreds of hours to complete just one pen. that MIGHT be an exaggeration, but they certainly put in lots of hours and they are quite good artists too.

Wayne

I noticed that the first time I mounted a mandrel into the lathe so I know what you are talking about. The live center that came with the lathe does indeed have a very pointed center. I am using a live center that I borrowed from my old metal lathe and it does have the 60 deg point.

I am fairly certain that loose bushings are a problem. Most of the other bushings I have fit much better than this particular set. I was thinking that I might try to wrap some scotch tape or something around the mandrel shaft the next time I use them. They shouldn't be worn out because I have only made about

6 or pens with them. Besides, they don't turn on the shaft anyway.

thanks,

Wayne

Wayne

Just bought the whole kit & caboodle at Klingspor's Saturday so we'll see soon what I've gotten into.

The fountain pen fascinates me, too :) Been YEARS since I wrote with one. Probably back at grade school.

IMO roller balls are spring loaded for a cushioned feel and they have a point that writes more like a fountain pen instead of a ball point - different ink as well, I think. In other words, a modern fountain pen that won't catch on the paper while writing fast like a fountain pen. Also, I saw a video where the guts are interchangeable so you can go either way after the pen is made.

TomNie

I have been told that not all sources are -exactly- the same size. If you buy your mandrel from one source, you should buy your pens and bushings from the same source. BTW, there are only 4 (or 5?) actuall sources in the USA, the others just sell the from them. But I don't recall the list (see penturners.org)

Actually there are 2 sizes of mandrels for the Berea pens. If you look at the Arizona Silhouette pen list some of the kits require a bearing with a B after the number. Those require the larger mandrel. Though if you are looking for accuracy you should use a micrometer to check the pen kit parts. There can be a big difference from 1 kit to the next. The bearings are just a rough guide. You can always make your own out of scrap stock there is no mystery to what they are. Also the bearings do wear out. Runout problems can be caused by a bent mandrel, putting to much pressure on the mandrel with the tailstock, bent tube etc. All of those suppliers are well known. They do not all carry the same Berea kits though and not to confuse the issue to much some of them call the same kit by different names. For a less intense group of penturners check out the penturners group on yahoo.

Paul snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com

On Apr 15, 3:50 pm, NoOne N Particular wrote:

I've found it best to purchase the mandrel, bushings and pen kits from the same source to avoid fit problems. I stick with Berea's products either ordering direct or purchasing locally from Rockler's.

I also know about the two different shafts for the Berea and Rockler mandrels. The one set that I am talking about is from Rockler with a Rockler pen kit and Rockler mandrel (the "A" mandrel).

Regarding runout, I don't think a bent mandrel is my problem and is another topic of discussion. One of them might be juuuuust a smidgeon bent now since I tried a little tweaking on it, but the others I think are straight. I cleaned off the flattest surfaces that I have (my table saw and bandsaw tables) and the shafts roll on them smoothly. If there was even a small amount of bend in the shaft, they wouldn't roll smoothly.

As for pressure from the tailstock, I have moved the tailstock in only far enough for the threaded end of the shaft to stop wobbling and tightened it down. At that point the two ends of the shaft will be running true (unable to feel any vibration in the shaft), but I can still feel a little bit of wobble in the middle. Even with a bare shaft with no pen blank or bushings etc. BUT, if the shafts are straight to begin with, why doesn't the shaft turn true without a tailstock in place?

This is why I think the runout might be another topic to discuss. That, to me, indicates a problem with the morse taper in the headstock, or perhaps the headstock shaft itself might be bent. It's like the taper on the mandrel isn't seating into the headstock taper straight. The mandrel does, however, fit tightly even with just a small amount of pressure when installing it, and it takes a good whack with the removal tool when the time comes. I've cleaned and examined all of the mandrel tapers and the headstock taper, and they are clean and appear undamaged. No galling, no burrs, no caked on finish, no stuck dust, filings, or chips, no nuttin.

I mentioned that the headstock shaft might be bent, but I have also put my dial indicator on the headstock and there is very negligible runout there. Putting the indicator point on the inside of the taper and had turning the shaft slowly, there is less than .001" runout. Maybe something on the order of .0003" or .0004" (3 or 4 TEN-thousandths). The indicator needle just barely moves. If the shaft were bent it seems like it would be more than that. And measuring a point outside the taper and behind the threads matched that reading.

Anyway, after all that I do appreciate your input.

Thanks,

Wayne

Yes. Tighten the nut holding the wood & bushings together so that they move as a unit. Discard loose bushings. Check mandrel OD's with a mic. They vary ... even within a brand. You may just have a bum mandrel shaft. They got the money, you got the shaft. Welcome to pen turning. Beware of tailstock creep. The sharp tailstock center provided with your lathe is meant to dig into end grain. Get a 60deg. center. HARDENED, if you can find one. Vary the rpm's at which you spin. You may be getting bitten by harmonic vibrations. See next answer.

I use the collet-type mandrel & chuck from PSI. In fact, I use several of them so that I can prep more than one pen at the same time. I DO NOT use 'spacer bushings', I push the mandrel into the collet as far as possible to reduce runout. The mandrels are soft and will flex. One tip: once I chuck up a mandrel and turn the wood, it doesn't leave the lathe until it is completed. I don't count on a dead-true re-chucking. Maybe it happens, maybe it doesn't. When it happens, I try not to act too surprised ... I want the lathe to think that this is how things are supposed to be. ;-)

I primarily get my kits from Woodturningz. Their online catalog is the pits. Period. However, they carry all of the pen kits in the PSI catalog (and most of the small tooling, as well) so you can just grab a paper catalog from PSI and fire off an e-mail to ryan woodturningz dotcom with your order. He'd prefer that you call in your order, but -I- prefer to have a written record of what I ordered and when. Not just my notes, but an actual, traceable, copy of the order. My experience with verbal orders has not been good ... they give me the hives. When an order gets scrambled, you can't be certain who is responsible and even if you are

99.9% certain that you didn't order 'this' or that you did order 'that', you certainly can't prove it to a third party.

I get my pen blanks from all over, and even have a few to sell on my own web site. If they have the species you want, I can recommend The Rivers Edge Exotics (eBay). I have curly tamarind and will soon have others.

I like to make the Designer, Sculptured and Cigar pens. They are both stylish and easy to hold and, as the baby boomers age, that is becoming more important to people.

Names quickly get confusing (on purpose, I think). I sell the most of the above pens and have repeat customers for each. The Polaris and Executive styles also sell okay.

A roller ball generally uses a gel-type ink. I haven't any direct experience with them so I can't give any further information. Other have replied with tips for additional resources.

You're welcome.

Bill

Bushings to me are a wear item. So I cut right up to them, ever so gently. Then I can usually get a perfect fit. tricker though when you have a brass tupe tennon sticking out. I then us a wide scraper to span the 1/8th inch gap and size up the wood that way.

Perhaps some scotch tape can tighten up a fit.

John

No> About 3 months ago I purchased a Delta 14" lathe and have been turning

I scribe off where the tube is to be exposed and cut straight across from the bushing to there, then taper the body to that point before removing the tenon material.

Just another way to get to the same end.

Bill

I would say that the tail centers you looked at are the standard. They are made for wood. My Jet also has a cup center around the point to keep the point from slitting the wood. I am not a big pen turner but I looked for a 60 degree point, because I didn't want to ruin my center from rubbing on metal. I found a Harbor freight that was cheap, probably for a metal lathe. The only problem was I could not find it in the store and had to order it on line and the shipping was almost as much as it was. I have been happy with both. One for wood and the other for the metal mandrel.

Bruce

CW wrote:

I've been using the 7mm nmadrel from Woodcraft with no problems such as you have had.

I'll put in a good word for Arizona Silhoutte - Bill gives excellent service and usually tosses in a "extra" such as a pen blank - I've wound up turning some blanks that I might otherwise have never picked. I also highly recommend Ken Nelson's laser inlayed / engraved pen kits at

I like the Baron models both in a FP and RB styles. I also like Sierra model especially for the snake skin type pen. I like the weight and quality of these kits. To a lesser extent SlimLine and Atlas are fun to make.

the penturner's group on Yahoo is also a good place to lurk for info.

Alex