Re: help please.

have him here because there is crap everywhere,<

Whaaaaaaaat??? Get outta town - I just can't believe it!!! I'm pretty sure it looks a heckuva lot better than my house right now (and we have company, LOL).

Carol in SLC My new stuff:

I really thought she was being jerky at first too, but when she explained her reasons (she really doesn't know anyone in the department and this pretty much got dumped on the supervisors when the department head left, and she really wants to do a fair job of it) she seemed sincere.

You really know me...

As it turned out I did appologize pretty sincerely when he called from teh local airport, and when he got home I actually had supper just ready to go (I am bad at that) and we had a really nice evening. He missed me SO much he never wants either of us to go anywhere again. Too bad that I found at least the first few days to be a well-needed break!

*Lsorta*

Oh, when he walked up the outside steps and knocked on the door, Mucha went CRAZY, calling and calling. Poor little guy. He gives a good impression of not caring that he's been shuttled from person to person a lot over what the vet claims are just about

2 years (well 2 1/2 or 3, now) of his life. But he has been acting funny since DH left (he won't go to sleep when covered but keeps "calling" the way he does when someone leaves and he wants them to stay, didn't eat normally for a few days, etc) He was on DH's shoulders the rest of the evening, though towards the end he was getting very bitey. When we put him to "bed" in our bedroom (covered up in his little house) and turned out the lights but kept talking, all these sad little whistles kept coming out :(

You are totally right about families. My family always expects people to call when they get somewhere on a trip (I perfer to call my parents and let them spread the monumental news to my grandparents if possible), while his family doesn't seem to care. Making him understand why my dad expected me to call when I flew half-way across the contenent to stay with some guy I met off the internet when I was 19 was almost impossible (I still can't believe my dad let me do that. I am sure he wouldn't have except that it was his idea (I was crying (something my dad can't stand) because I was sad that my friend wasn't coming to visit me. Before he thought about it, my dad said "why don't you go visit him?")).

But he's known me for a while now.

If nothing else, he couuld take it as a symptom of my anxiety. I would NEVER want to be as bad as my dad, who's "treatment" for his anxiety seems to be controlling my mom's and brother's every move, but considering that I eventually start worrying someone is dead if I haven't heard from him in days and I know he is travelling to have brief visits with relatives all over hte province of B.C. so that I couldn't figure out how to get ahold of him if I wanted to...

We've had these discussions before. I specifically DIDN'T want to make a specific schedule since I would be the one who was hurt if he forgot to contact me at hte promised time, something he is very likely to do. (I can blame the ADD for this now that he has been diagnosed, which makes me feel somewhat better and can stop me from just thinking he is an insensative jerk.) But for the first week he was gone he managed to email every day. After one really horrible call whcih brought back all of the seperation feelings from when we had a long-distance relationship, I realized I was doing better with some separation from him. I didn';t even mind no contact for a couple of days after that. But ON the phonecall we discussed our unspoken agreement for him to be writing and responding to emails regularly on the trip --- he acknoledged that there was such an "unspoken" agrement. Which made it much odder that he broke it immediatly following that conversation and I had no communication from him whatsoever for the days he was traveling all over B.C. and Washington state. I know he was busy while he was traveling, but sheesh, he managed to contact me from an airport.

Mucha was very good and ate from Birdy Plate.

Sorry to gross you out by Mucha's antics. (I always feed dogs form the table, I'm afraid, but never did for a parakeet before the vet said people food is good for him and he turned out to have an intense fear of people-food inside of his cage)

marisa2

"Christina Peterson" wrote in message news:1060375460.769544@prawn...

The thing is, he doesn't really do it. He claims he can't see stuff that fell (or otehrwise arrived) on the floor because he is too tall. I have never understood why he can't see spills ont eh counter or cabinets left open in the kitchen (I REALLY am not a prefectionist, but it just bugs me when the cabinets are all left open. I mean, how easy is it to close the door after you have taken something out?).

HOWEVER he had a really gross-out experience at his sister's place on his trip (apparently when he pointed out hte line of ants coming through the kitchen, she and her boyfriend said "oh yeah, they came in last year too". They also didn't seem to mind the mold on dirty dishes all over the kitchen (we get piles of dishes but mold is the limit!) or even notice when they walked in from doing yard work and brought in piles of dirt.) So, he claims he has done a lot of thinking about keeping the house clean and a lot of planning about how he is going to do it from now on. SO, we'll see.

I do think it is good for me to do at least some of it. Otherwise, it is just anotehr thing for me to feel powerless about , and another thing for us to fight about. My therapist chewed me out about whining about hte house one day. She said that instead of complianing to him about it and then sinking into a depression in a corner somewhere, I should just FIX it. There were some things about that conversation I didn't like, but ultiatemly I think she is right. I feel too out of control about too many things right now, and frankly, wiping up stuff off the counter or picking up my own pile of junk are activities well within my capabilities.

It could be, although I think they would've identified it at the program (for the first few weeks I was there, there were a bunch of people who were bi-polar, at least a couple of whom were on the low end. I am kind of happy I dont have that... after many personal testimonies by my fellow patients, I am convinced that people who are bi-polar really need their lithium (or similar medicine) and it does definately dampen their creativitiy from what I can tell.)

It seems likely.

Sorry :).

Um, I have object-oriented *L*'s. *Lsorta*, *Lserious*, and *Lstupid* are all sub-categories (or "children", in object-oriented terminology = if you are a programmer) of *L*. So, *Lsorta* means "laughing sort of".

Wow. I never heard of it referred to as "overstimulation" before. That is how I view the anxiety for sure.

That is what I (was supposed to have) learned at hte program... replacing unhealthy thinking habits, getting rid of co-dependance. (:Like I said, I think I did good about removing my co-dependant tendencies on a lot of other people, but not on DH)

How do you know what the limits are?

One thing that came out early in my therapy and that I can see really clearly in myself (and my Dad) now: I used the symptoms of anxiety to get me through life, and really to fight against the depression, all of my life. For instance, I have a poor memory, but I can count on my constant obsessive worrying to "ping" me to do the things I need to do. I have a tendency to procrastinate, but a good panic attack always drove me to complete all my school assignments on time no matter what it took. But at some point about 2 1/2 years ago that system completely fell apart; the obsessive thoughts took over entirely, and I was feeling too down to even move sometimes much less accomplish waht I needed to. I started taking medications. The ones with really bad physical side-effects that wouldn't go away after a few weeks they took me off of. The ones that had emotional and mental side-effects were harder to figure out, because those could be attributed to the depression and anxiety. Cloudiness of thought, loss of short-term memory, inability to remember words, dizziness, and intense fear of DH were some of them. It isn';t that I am sure that no medicine can help me, but I would REALLY like to see if I can go it without medicine using other kinds of techniques (like the ones you are talking about) so that I don't have to keep going thorugh these cycles of trying medicines which completely ruin my life, especially since, all in all, I feel much better off of them then I have on any of them and the stuff I did at hte program DID seem to help me, although sometimes I regress and am really disappointed in myself. Especially right now, I do NOT need to be on a medicine which messes with my head to the extent that I sit htere at work all day breaking things and can't talk straight enough to get any thoughts across (not to mention, not having thoughts worth getting across).

Of course, I don't feel I'm getting thoughts across perfectly now, but it is a DIFFERENT set of problems.

I'm really trying to do the Excersize thing. I would feel better about myself if I weren't so overweight and out of condition (almost dying on a walk that people twice my age had no problem with) also. It is hard to get myself to do it (the excerisze) but I know I need to! Thanks for driving it in again.

That definately seems to be necessary. I think I carry a "sleep dept" of many thousands of hours now...

Yeah, that is really hard for me.

I am not extroverted. It is hard because people keep telling me that I need friends who are not my family. How does one do this? Friends don't grow on trees, and I don't lilke group activities at all.

Good suggestions, especially since I am a strict vegetarian.

ok

I keep thinking I might have a thyroid problem (they are on both sides of my family) but the blood tests never show this.

intentions,

What do you mean about "toss out what you can of physical stuff"?

I don't do much physical stuff... I thought I should do more?

This was my choice, after a lot of discussions... he is right that I am doing much better... I am guessing some factors in his mind are the fact that I can sit still in the chair at all, look him in the eye and smile when we are talking, DH says I am doing better, and that I told him I think I'm doing better.

Frankly, I think that I did work hard on the anxiety symptoms when I was in the program and I think I really am doing better there (Thursday's episode aside :/ ). But the depression is more..insidious.

I scanned through Co-Dependance No More. I should see if one of the others is at the library.

it's really helpful for me to know that people who seem to be doing so well have gone through this stuff too...

thanks

marisa2

I actually deleted a message yesterday saying "It sounds like the Captain is getting the passengers on the Titanic to throw each other overboard so he doesn't have to decide who gets a lifeboat seat himself.

This is designed to make the people who have survived so far less and less like companions in misery, and more like enemies and rivals.

I think it sucks sewage. And represents and especially chicken-hearted (if not heartless) management style.

I deleted the message because I couldn't bring it down to the level of "pissed but rational". Kathy, calling this supervisor a jerk is mild compared to what I was thinking ... about how much worse they are making an already bad situation when it comes to how the people they are responsible for are affected by nasty circumstances. And how well they are -able- to relate to each other for the duration of those nasty circumstances.

Deirdre

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Christina Peterson" :

]No, I mean toss out those Geographics that you've been saving. The books ]you plan to read that look accusingly at you. The belt you plan to fix. ]The nuts and bolts you might use. The articles you ought to re-read. The ]dishes you hate that your grandmother gave you. The letters from people you ]might want to answer. Records from the past 3 years of you electric bill. ]The dress you hate that fits well and the one you love that doesn't fit. ]Don't take on the responsibility of more pets. Don't keep the box you might ]want to send something back in. The supplies from a craft you no longer do. ]Toss out physical things. Clear your house of things to use up brain power ]just by having them in your line of sight.

gods, Tina. i wish i could make myself do this! i just CAN'T. and yes, the clutter it creates drives me crazy.

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

Bill of Rights - Void where prohibited by Law.Regime Change in 2004 - The life you save may be your own.

I keep trying, because it doesn't just drive me crazy, it drives me disabled.

Tina

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Christina Peterson" :

]I keep trying, because it doesn't just drive me crazy, it drives me ]disabled.

yes - that's what i meant. but there's this incredible compulsion NOT to throw anything out, too. the conflict between the two is unreal.

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

Bill of Rights - Void where prohibited by Law.Regime Change in 2004 - The life you save may be your own.

{{{{{{{{Tina}}}}}}}}} Great stuff in this whole response, Tina. You put it all very well. The "overstimulation" part of depression is very real, and even autism is now being viewed by some as a profound non-ability to separate out the stimuli, and being unable to deal with it all at once to the point of turning away. Sarajane

Sarajane's Polymer Clay Gallery

view my auctions at:

I hear you loud and clear. This is a tough call for artists--much of "junk" really is quite useful. (Maybe. And we do a lot in preparation for the maybes, don't we??) But remember, you can always go find more of most things if you REALLY need them. Save the irreplaceable scraps of beaded lace. Toss the National Geographics. Sarajane

Sarajane's Polymer Clay Gallery

view my auctions at:

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from snipped-for-privacy@aol.comeatspam (Sjpolyclay) :

]Save the irreplaceable scraps of beaded lace. Toss the ]National Geographics.

ROTFLOL! dh got me the NG's on cd, so we COULD get rid of those. what i have problems with are things like my grandmothers old "Workbasket magazines" and her knitting books (10cents then). things the kids might appreciate me hanging onto for them until they have real places of their own. scrapbooks from high school . . . do i need to go on?

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

Bill of Rights - Void where prohibited by Law.Regime Change in 2004 - The life you save may be your own.

My supervisor has been put in a disgusting position herself. Having to fire people is the hardest job of any supervisor anyhow. Being suddenly thrown into it after something else was SUPPOSED to happen was really bad. And she has all of us going in for reassurance and doesn't have anything to say. I understand why it comes across differently, but because I know her I know that she really is torn because she wants to do the "right" thing and wants to defend her own people as best as she can.

I still didn't appreciate being put into this situation, but I understand why she did it and it wasn't out of malicious intent.

Of course, the horribly crappy things beign done to us by UPPER management probably aren't from consiously malicious intent either, but I really do feel anger and some level of hatred for them, because I really believe that to them we are just a bunch of cogs that they believe can fit in any hole they put us in. As they explained to us at a recent "town meeting", they apparently have to GROW the board of directors because some people might be retiring in 2-3 years and it takes time to learn that job (never mind that a CEO can transfer in from Kraft or Toys R Us to a telecommunications company and think they know how to run the buisness), but apparently programming and engineering jobs of people with 20 years of experience can be transferred to people from China with 2 years of testing experience and little or no actual development experience in a matter of months. Because of course programming or engineering is just putting pieces together, right? Anyone can do that.

marisa2

On Sat, 9 Aug 2003 21:38:08 -0400, marisa2 wrote (in message ):

Marisa, please don't make excuses for your supervisor. I've been exactly where she is, with a new team, conflicting mandates from above and the task to cut the headcount by XX%. I didn't like it, but I did the job, because it was my job. I didn't put any of my people on the spot, and I think I was as fair as possible under the circumstances.

No, of course she wasn't being malicious, she was making it easy on herself. By getting your input, she was saving herself from having to do the research and make the hard decision. I am absolutely sure that Lucent has a personnel file on each and every employee, with their resume and a copy of every review they've had since then. There may be old supervisors around who know some of these people. Your supervisor has plenty of information available to make her decision without putting you on the spot.

BTW, I never made my decisions without getting to know the people personally. I did it by taking every one of my people out to breakfast on a regular basis. We'd go to a diner around the corner and meet informally without the office intruding. By the time I got to that point, I already knew a lot about the person, from the files and from my own observations. Some pancakes and informal conversation let me answer any questions I had in my own mind.

When the rubber hit the road, I'd sit in my own living room with my own notes, and make a spreadsheet with all the variables I needed to make a decision. (Productivity, good reviews, absenteeism, teamwork, etc.) After I plugged in the numbers, my decision was made. I'd then have a good cry and a sleepless night - and in the morning, I'd stand tall and do what I had to. I might have discussed my findings with my immediate supervisor, but usually, I was on my own. I never, ever would have done what your supervisor did.

They have to do that. They don't answer to the employees, they answer to the stockholders, who have come to expect growth every quarter, no matter what. Of course they look at the rank and file employees as cogs -- if they put a real human face on the situation, they couldn't possibly perform their function.

I think that the job exporters are going to find out that you get exactly what you pay for, and that a $2,000/year employee is worth exactly that. But right now, the industry is experimenting with job exportation, and the reality is that no company can survive if all their competitors are cutting their labor costs by 90 - 95%.

Kathy N-V

I like this. And I agree with Becki's original message with only a minor cavil: I think that although we aren't in charge of our total fate, or the circumstances around us ... we -can- influence both through our own choices and actions in how we *relate* to both of those things.

Not "What I say goes!" but "Even in this tight spot, I can still make choices".

Deirdre

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from snipped-for-privacy@aol.comnospam (Kaytee) :

]Or, probably being crazy causes me to collect the clutter-- it's all valuable ]stuff... I might NEED it someday.... It does drive hubby crazy... ]It really causes me a lot of anxiety to "toss" stuff, even though, ]intellectually, I know I'll never get around to fixing it, using it all up, ]reading it again, or getting big/small enough to wear it.... I have to "toss" ]in small doses-- and then what's left seems to expand, and the piles seem to ]stay the same size.. and hubby decides to "help" by doing the "tossing"-- and I ]feel physically sick over the "loss"....

yep. and i'm JUST like my father.

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

Bill of Rights - Void where prohibited by Law.Regime Change in 2004 - The life you save may be your own.

Give the old magazines to the Friends of the closest library. They'll sell them (someone will buy almost anything) and use the money to buy the library more money. Although I have to say that NGs are a lot like zucchini this time of year--lock your car at the library or you may come back to find the back seat full of old NGs and zucchini.

I gave our FOL about 20 years of McCall's Crafts and Needlework and they sold every one to one buyer who paid a premium for them.

Never throw out a magazine if you have an FOL around. They'll even come pick everything up if you have enough.

Ditto the standard stuff, not the personal things. Give them to a local charity that runs a thrift shop. That way, you don't have to actually throw anything out. They'll do that if it's necessary and you'll never know. Meanwhile you can tell yourself everything is going to be used by people who need it.

It's surprising how much easier it is to get rid of stuff when you know you're doing good. It's not at all like throwing it away. It's just so much easier.

Mary

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from Mary Shafer :

]Give the old magazines to the Friends of the closest library.

but they were my GRANDMOTHER's. i love them.

**sniff, sniff**

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

Bill of Rights - Void where prohibited by Law.Regime Change in 2004 - The life you save may be your own.

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from snipped-for-privacy@aol.comnospam (Kaytee) :

]My hubby plans to die before either me or my father-- just so he doesn't have ]to deal with our "junks"....

that's what my mother is trying to do now - with help from my brothers. it's probably a good thing i'm not around.

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

Bill of Rights - Void where prohibited by Law.Regime Change in 2004 - The life you save may be your own.

It's up to you. They still interfere with access to mental energy. Which would you miss more, that or an item among many that reminds you of your grandmother?

Tina

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Christina Peterson" :

]It's up to you. They still interfere with access to mental energy. Which ]would you miss more, that or an item among many that reminds you of your ]grandmother?

that's the problem.

maybe i just need a better storage system. i need to know i can put my hands on them, but not necessarily within five minutes.

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

Bill of Rights - Void where prohibited by Law.Regime Change in 2004 - The life you save may be your own.