Numbering of axes.

The origin of any graph is always at (0,0)

-5 -4 -3 -2 -1 0 1 2 3 4 5

-5

-4

-3

-2

-1

0 1 2 3 4 5

(And so on, forgive the formatting, non-proportional font and all.)

As for Pattern Maker's numbering, starting in in the top left would make perfect sense to a person who starts stitching in the top left, would it not?

If I place a stitch in the top left square in my version of Pattern Maker Pro 3.10, it appears in the status bar as 1, 1, with Column being the first number and Row being the second, similar in manner to the cell designations in an Excel spreadsheet. It makes sense to me, not so much that one starts stitching from the top left, but because resizing the graph is done to the right and downwards. My version does not print out numbers on the graph, however, it is not only a Viewer. Just my observation.

-- Carey in MA (stepping back to listen...)

OMG--eight years later and your still arguing this point. It's nice to see something's don't change.

Dorsey in VA

"Dorsey Clement" had some very interesting things to say about Re: Numbering of axes.:

At least he's on-topic, unlike some of the recurring fires around here.

Hi Seanette:

Honestly that's pretty normal for this group. Kinda like a big extended family that fuss and fights. But I can tell you first hand--when push comes to shove, they are all praying and pulling for you.

Dorsey "Seanette Blaylock" wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com...

Is it really only eight years? I thought it was longer than that. I am somewhat a student of history, and I seem to recall there was a gentleman by the name of Gallilleo, who, contrary to the then current church doctrine, stated that the earth went round the sun. I believe some

350 years later, the church offered an apology for being wrong. If an idea is fundamentally, and scientificly sound, it will never go out of date. I am sure others may disagree with me, but I sincerely believe my ideas as to how to improve the presentation of counted cross stitch patterns are fundamentally sound. If anyone can show me I am wrong, I will be more than happy to apologize.

-- Jim Cripwell. From Canada. Land of the Key Bird. This creature of doom flies over the frozen tundra in winter, shrieking its dreaded call; "Key, Key, Key, Key rist but it's cold!!"

Doubt if you`ll be around to do that in 350 years, Jim!

Pat P

Meant to say that Brian Hughes (PastMaster Charter) has been doing it for years, on his enormous charts. However, having done most of them, I can safely say that I never made the slightest use of the numbered axes ( never even noticed them for some time). As long as each page matched up with the surrounding ones, I found that it was all you needed, particularly if you photocopy each page as you go and mark each stitch off with a highlighter - and grid your fabric, of course.

Talking of that, I`m so glad that I have a huge supply of the pregridded Aida - it really does help, and speeds things up. The "gridding" is done along the top of every tenth stitch instead in every tenth hole, so you don`t stab the needle through it. The only downside is remembering whether the grid thread is the FIRST stitch or the TENTH. It`s quite easy to pull it out though, which is a bonus. I know it`s a bit more expensive, and haven`t come across it in evenweave, but I do wish it was more widespread than it is.

Pat P

Actually, I wont have to wait that long. Not being a designer, or publisher, or anything else, I cannot actually *do* anything about my ideas. Someone else needs to implement them. Now, for the first time, Pattern Maker has made it possible for designers who use their software to have numbered axes on their patterns. This raises the possibility of many unlikely things that *may* occur in the future.

Will any designers make use of the numbered axes that are provided by Pattern Maker, so their designs appear in print with numbered axes? Will stitchers find these numbered axes useful? Will stitchers "demand" that *all* patterns have numbered axes? Will people realize that this "wonderful" idea of numbered axes "originated" with Jim Cripwell, so maybe it is worthwhile taking a look at some of his other ideas?

Personally, I will "stay tuned", but probably very few others will.

-- Jim Cripwell. From Canada. Land of the Key Bird. This creature of doom flies over the frozen tundra in winter, shrieking its dreaded call; "Key, Key, Key, Key rist but it's cold!!"

Actually, I have been using PC Stitch for about 5 to 6 years and they HAVE ALWAYS printed the numbers on the axes. They also start at the top left since you have the ability to expand the pattern to the right and down. I have always used them as reference points that help my stitching. As to whether to start at 0,0 or 1,1 is always an issue as to whether you are counting discreet elements (1,1) or as a reference point or index (0,0). Mathematicians seemed to think that real physical entities can be described with a 0. If I'm counting stitches, I count 1, 2, 3... not the 0th, first, second, etc., etc. I run into this issue in programming as well. Arrays are always indexed 0 to n which represent the first to the nth+1 item.

Michael F. Parenteau Software Analyst for 39 years with Unisys.

?I seem to recall there was a

I don't think anyone can prove that you are wrong--this is an opinion about what would make cross stitch patterns easier to work. Some people don't share your opinion, perhaps because numbered axes wouldn't significantly change the way they work, or be of obvious benefit for the kinds of patterns they prefer. This is somewhat different from Galileo, who discovered a significant fact about the way things are, the kind of thing that could be demonstrated or refuted if it were wrong. Personally I would ignore numbered axes if they were printed (an opinion based on my own experience of my own preferences, just as yours is), since I am more shape oriented than count oriented, but see no reason they couldn't be there for those stitchers who would find them useful. Dawne

Jim,

It sounds like you need to learn a programming language and develop your own software. That, or find an eager-beaver programmer or a just-learning high school student who love to take on projects, and work with them to come up with something. As the old saying goes, "If you want something done right, you've got to do it yourself."

I am in agreement with your opinions, being a scientist by trade. (0,0) should be lower left corner, and for the purposes of cross-stitch, the coordinate tick marks should be the squares, not the lines.

Barbara HJ

ROFLOL--Jim your one in a million. I saw you'd replaced your old computer with a lap top. Is it easier to take back and forth to the cottage?

Boy eight long years of not being able to stitch or design. Drop back in here to get caught up on the latest trends and news and yours was the first post that down loaded.

What happened to the rest of the old gang? Where's Terri, Lula, Dragon hag and the rest. Haven't seen any post from them.

I have been around, maybe five or six years. Folks come and go. Some we really miss, and the others are remembered kindly. I could list many folk who I personally miss, first and foremost, probably Kathy Dyer, the fount of all good information. IIRC was it Nan Evelyn who kept all the urls on a humongous database?? And how an anyone forget Trish's impossible tales?? LOL

on the other hand there are super folk who have joined, and I definitely consider the, close friends. I have beeen fortunate enough to meet some of the group, and that makes it REALLY close friends!!

If nothing else this group is a bottomless well of stitching information!! Gillian

"Dorsey Clement" had some very interesting things to say about Re: Numbering of axes.:

I've been here off and on for at least six years, so do have a good handle on "normal" around here. ;-)

OTOH, I know of at least two newsgroups that are as active as this one or more so and MUCH more friendly and courteous.

I can hardly wait to hear why you bother with this one then if it is - by extension - unfriendly and discourteous.

If you want sick-makingly sweet and boring then you definitely shouldn`t bother with us! LOL!

Pat P

Hi Dosrey

Nice to see a post from you again. One of the last things I remember you doing was teaching hardanger on silk gauze. That is something that always intrigued me and I often wondered how you did it?

Lula still posts but I believe she keeps herself quite busy. She always brings up interesting topics when she can be with us. Unfortunately, Dragon Hag, owner of Needle Necessities, died several years ago but her threads are still being produced. I'm not sure which Terri you are referring to as we have had several.

So what has been new in your life that you may want to share?

Mavia

Hi Mavia:

I'm very sorry to hear about Dragon hag--contrary to her name she was a very, very nice lady. Always helpful and had tons and tons of great knowledge. I'm very sadden to hear of her passing.

Glad to hear Lula is still around. LOL and was woundering what happened to all the Terri's.

What have I been doing..............mostly getting a new perspective on things. And from what I've seen so far looking in to trends and designs--seems that things have caught up to what I was doing outside the box. Hardanger on silk gauze is simply just looking at the fabric, your scroll frame and seeing it from a different perspective. I saw and still do see it as a weaving loom. And I think that's why hardanger appeals so much to me.

I still have designs floating around in my head. And will be designing again once I get the ok to spend more time in front of the computer. (FYI--I have a softwhite, ott lite and a regular lite in the computer/quilting/design room). Few simple freebies at first to see if I'm getting back in step and a few new twists. So we'll see. This time things will be taken at a slower pace and I'm going to enjoy the entire process of designing from start to finish.

LOL I have a day job so this time there will be no pressure to pump out designs either.

It's great being back........I've really missed you all.