Does your shop comply with fire safety codes?

"Arch" wrote: (clip) If your shop-home-garage sustained a fire today would an inspection give the insurance company enough evidence to successfully deny your claim? ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Arch, I hope this is a hypothetical question--you're not having insurance problems, are you? I'm not a lawyer, so I will give up on any point on which I am challenged, but this is how I think it is: When you buy insurance, you are subject to inspection, and the insurer may require you to fix certain things. Then they have the right to check you whenever they feel like it while the policy is in effect, but they rarely do. If they don't, I doubt that they can deny coverage after you have been paying your premiums in good faith. It's different for commercial insurance, where annual inspections are common.

You're not running a drug lab in your shop, are you? I'm sure that could make a difference. ;-)

No inspectors or fire yet, Leo. Thanks for your opinion and your concern. It is reassuring. I posted these hypotheticals after viewing the realities of my shop. :)

Turn to Safety, Arch Fortiter

Speaking as a guy who unintentionally, yet carelessly, set fire to his own shop, the question not answered here: what codes, guidelines, rules, etc. that are required by a safety inspector for a home shop?

I have three fire extinguishers. I have a smoke detector in the garage.Most of my finishes are stored in safe locations. Volatile stuff in a metal tool chest. I sweep infrequently. I have dry or drying wood piled high on shelving. My electrical is to code. I use dust collection and an air filter. What else are the do's or don'ts?

Joe

Did you remember to ground your DC?

(ducking!)

Bill

Arch,

One thing that every woodturner, who ever sells any of their stuff, needs to look into is whether their shop is actually covered by their home owner's insurance. I checked and found that mine would not be covered since it is a business as far as the insurance company is concerned. Therefore, I carry insurance for my shop through the AAW arranged insurance program.

A few years ago, a woodturner had his shop burn down and found that his homeowner's insurance would not cover it because he sold some of his woodturning output. It is worth checking into and the insurance through the AAW is not too expensive and it also covers me for demonstrations and for teaching in my shop.

I recommend that everyone who has a woodturning shop and ever sells anything or teaches classes in their shop check with their insurance company to see if they are covered.

Fred Holder

The first thing the insurance company will ask is do you have dust collection. The second is do you have a smoke alarm. The third is where is the fire extinguisher. The forth is where is the flamable liquids cabinet. I have been turned down by several companies because I don't have a sprinkler system. Also like Fred said, most home owners insurance will not cover wood shops, or only minimally, especially if you sell some stuff. You don't have to be professional, you can be a hobbyiest who sells some things to help support your habbit. Some home owners insurance companies will cancel you outright if they find out you have a wood shop. The AAW insurance covers you for woodturning only. robo hippy

My shop would fail. I have too much wood and have not (yet) contained all my finishes and paints in a fire-proof enclosure. The fire department suggested to keep the finishes outdoors in a (fake) dog house with a hinged roof. But, the FD was impressed to see a fire extinguisher and smoke detector in my shop!

"Phisherman" wrote: (clip) the FD was impressed to see a fire extinguisher and smoke detector in my shop! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Out of curiosity, what was the reason for the fire department inspection? Is yours a commercial or a home shop? I'm guessing home, kuz they would consider extinguishers and smoke alarms normal in a commercial setting. And I can't imagine them suggesting a "dog house" for a commercial shop.

A fellow employee of mine built his own house, by converting a barracks. I considered him a mechanical genious. An example of what he did was put an old-fashioned grease pit in his garage, so he could walk under his car. But the thing I really want to bring up here is: halfway up his stairs he built in a recess, where he hung a garden hose long enough to reach either end of his house, either upstairs or downstairs. They say that the first fraction of a minute after a fire starts is critical. His idea probably could have saved his house if he had needed it.

So, have I done this? No. Why not? Well, this is the first time I have thought of it until Arch now.

Thanks, Arch. Losing one's house has to do with a lot more than just insurance.

I asked the FD for an inspection.

They suggested keeping flammables (including gasoline) separate from the house. A (fake) dog house does not need a permit in our town, but a shed does.

A garden hose is an excellent idea. My town requires a one-day fire permit to burn wood or leaves. The permit requires a garden hose to be hooked up and ready.

What good is homeowners insurance?

Hear me out. I'm starting to get the distinct impression that so many things are becoming excluded, that it's really not so long before one might say "what's the point?" and simply go without.

Several years ago, maybe 15, American Family discontinued the sewer backup part of my insurance. Then the part about pouring anything that causes environmental problems down a drain. Or on the ground I suppose. Then the mold exclusions. I read that people that make a few claims are routinely dropped. And water damage. I've read that they'll go so far as to note that a particular house has had claims of that nature and after that, NO insurance company will cover it.

Then in the local paper (Milwaukee Journal/Sentinel) they had a story about a woman with a fairly old dog (it looked like a little spaniel of some kind) of about 10 or 12 years, bit someone in response to being kicked. Now the insurance company insists that the dog be put down or they'll refuse to renew. And they want proof. Giving the dog away doesn't work to satisfy them. They think the dog might come back to that house. So says the story.

Then there's all the shenanigans in the hurricane prone areas of the country.

I mean, really, what's it coming to? I buy insurance to cover me for the events that happen that cause enough damage or loss that I can't pay for myself. A fire, a storm that trashes my roof, maybe a burglary.

In my opinion, they're in the business of assuming risk. They should just suck it up and realize that bad things happen. They know the odds. Set the rates accordingly.

And no, I don't sell my stuff, but I do plenty of woodworking. Obviously lots of flammable stuff around here. Piles of wood and some finishes.

Ummm... Does having a smoke alarm and a fire extingisher count? If it does, I guess I'm good to go. If there's more to it, I have no idea. The wiring is up to code, too.

Today? Probably- I've been cleaning my (new) old lathe with Kerosine for the last couple of hours.

Howdy - Short time reader, first time poster.

Can't agree more heartily!!! My take is that the business has shifted from ASSUMING risk, to trying to MANAGE risk, which means cut out anything you know, or even suspect, to have associated risk.... Further, at least here in Texas, the state Insurance Board does NOTHING to help the consumer - it's all about how much influence the larger companies buy them off.... No value at all (Please don't let me get started...)

The ONLY reason I carry insurance is because my mortgage company insists - if I had no mortgage, I'd have no insurance.... Might regret it at some point, but that's MY philosophy....

MHO, NGA