Spending a 100 hours

Some, perhaps regard the practice of segmented turning as more a project in architecture than turning. With so much turning wood available on the woodpile, I haven't been tempted to go to my lumber stack in years.

Still it's the journey, not the destination. Most of us sell our results for cash and treasure the time at the lathe.

George

I have no problem with your opinions. Too each their own. Does a doctor need all his training. Hell no ! No more than an architect needs his. Is this world of technology there are slow and faster ways to get results. Universities weed out the good from the average " or so they think ". But the end result is that they turn out just as many bad doctors and engineers as every other form of education. So does the slow way to seqment turn out better seqment turners.( I think not ) From both methods we get excellent and poor seqment turners. Just because you happen to be brillant at math ( and i,m no refering to you personably ) doesn,t nescessarily make you a good architect.. As with teachers " a teachers degree doesn,t mean you can impart knowledge ". It means you should be able too, but we all know that far from the truth.

Keith

In my opinion, if you have 100 hours at the lathe, then you should use that time to become proficient at using your head, eyes, hands and tools. Too many turners waste their time just gnawing away at a chunk of wood with no direction, no plan and no attention to the skill they are applying to the task. They just dive in!

I look at it this way. In the years past, people used to apprentice with a master for years and years before they were allowed to put their names on the finished product or even do it themselves. This was a way to ensure that the person learned how to think about the things they were doing. The apprentice was basically "going to school" instead of work. In many forms of craft, the practice is still being used - glass blowing, porceline pottery, finish carpentry and on and on.

I recently read a book where there was a specific apprenticship program outlined with a set of tasks to be mastered - not just completed but mastered. I think there should be a similar set of tasks set up for people who want to learn to become a woodturner.

Maybe then our works will be more highly prized and valued across the art world!

Ray

Glad to hear your philosophy, though puzzled why you wouldn't use a sled on a tablesaw as primary over a cutoff saw with its angle control problems and safety problems with clearance on small pieces. I preferred one sled per angle - number of segments - used those spring-loaded hold downs to keep my fingers out of the way.

Strange you should mention proficiency at math as an asset for architects. The story at our local university is that architects weren't good enough at math to be engineers nor gay enough to be decorators....

I believe he was referring to time spent assembling a vessel. Can't recall segmented taking any more time than non to actually turn.

Well said George.

The problem that I have with the sled is that all of the diagrams that i looked at, were assumming that i had a more than basic knowledge of woodworking. I find it difficult to cut a piece of wood straight " even on my small cheapie table saw " The pictures that i looked at weren,t much of a help either. BACKGROUND = I worked as a TV technician and as a technician. myself and others had difficulty undering the operating manuals written by the engineers. We used to have to play with the equipment to understand how they functioned. Most engineers can,t simplify instructions.Pictures on the web concerning HOW TO make the sled Assume a basic knowledge which i don,t mind admitting " i don,t have " Hence i was looking for a solution that i could understand. George thanks for the conversation, I enjoyed it. Now back to the Web too further confuse myself. Lol

Keith

Ray

Don,t jump to conclusions. I think about what i doing. I havn,t jumped in yet to make my seqmented salad bowl.I have 3 10 by 10 peices of paid for birch ( $40.00 worth ) I have turned a box which for a very first attempt turned out decent but not good. The design was simple 22 and 1/2 degree sides ( 8 sides ) with walnut inserted. I realize the importance of having a proper clean angle. Its just that I,m was looking for a simplified way to do it. Art is in the eye of the beholder and has nothing to do with how we arrive at it. If justifying why we as turners Charge what we charge and use engineering and math as critera we are just fooling ourselfs. Do you really think that if most people admire what you turn and are willing to give your price, that they really give a tinker dam how you did it.

My 2 cents worth

Keith

Oh, I understand the art/craft argument - my comment was akin to the difference between a guitar player and a guitarist - there is a difference. It takes tremendous study and practice to become a guitarist.

My comment was meant to be constructive and insightful - if one can apply themselves to learning, focusing, planning and executing instead of muddling and fumbling along then that will make a diference in how the person arrives - either a wow or a dud. There is a fine line between the two - like the fine line between a groove and a rut.

It all has to do with the way one thinks and executes while standing at the lathe.

Ray

After my years spent trying to troubleshoot Motorola transmitters and control systems using their manuals, I understand fully.

===================== George, I spent 20+ years working on imported medical equipment (Siemens from Germany, CGR from France, Benelux from Belgium, and Generay from Italy). I was confused in several different languages and schematic symbols.

Ken Moon Webberville, TX

Did they update the manuals and schematics when they changed the equipment? That lack was a big surprise to me. Guess I was spoiled by posting the never-ending changes in the military.

Trying to make sense of a Pidgin sprayer manual last evening. As I used to do some "idiomatic" translation - smooth the English after Russians had done the words - I realize it's not easy. Wonder why they don't do the second level, though.

Ken If it was only a language problem we could use a good translator. I guess that all of that analitical education ( excuse spelling ) disables their ability to look at a operating situation from an operators point of view.Part of their problem seems to be their assumption that we all understand what they are thinking. ( we can read their minds.)

My 2 cents worth

Sincerely Keith

Sorry should have been " We can,t read their minds "

============================= George, When a new "family" of equipment came out, they'd send you to class to learn it, and you could make notes on hard copies of schematics. Updates were sent out on microfiche. Ever try to work on a piece of equipment with a poorly lit portable microfiche reader?? The procedures were also a joke. Most were written in the native language, and translated by language "experts". The word by word translation some times has no connection with the original technical meaning. Also, as Keith said, the engineeers who designed the equipment often were not trained as tech writers, so their procedures often did not work as written. I don't understand why manufacturers don't realize the importance of tech writers and how much time can be saved in the installation and maintenance times when clear instructions are available.

Ken

Or even "We can't read their minds" :)