Need some advice - Beadwork Dilemma

Kathy, I would wait for a time for a response from them. They may have to take your request before the Tribal Council. If you don't hear in two weeks or so, I would write again and ask if they have a Wisdom Keeper (the member of their nation who is in charge of passing on their traditions) and see if you could talk/send your request directly to her/him. Patti

I don't know anything about tribes or tribal customs and can't presume to speak on this topic.

Becki "In between the moon and you, the angels have a better view of the crumbling difference between wrong and right." -- Counting Crows

Whenever I work on a cultural project, I try to keep away from that culture's religious symbols in my work but anything else is fair game. In other words, I might use a lotus blossom, chrysanthumum blossom or cherry blossom in an Asian design, but no symbols that would represent Asian Gods or Buddhas. You might want to visit Wandering Bull, an NA shop in Attleboro. Andy sells lots of regalia supplies and is very knowledgable about his culture in a non-Foxwoods kind of way, I'm sure he could advise you. He has books of designs for regalia and II know he sells regalia patterns. I don't think there is an Alqonquin book but the Algonquins were part of the Northeast Woodland Indian culture and I'm pretty sure he has books about them if he can't personally advise you. Here is a link to his site although I would strongly recommend a visit scheduled for when Andy is working:

this helps.

Letrinka

I see your dilemma! I know out here where I'm from, on the West Coast, there are still many Native Americans that make their living selling their authentic beadwork (I drove from Los Angeles to Washington in August, and they had little booths set up at nearly every rest area), so *I* would feel uncomfortable making anything to sell, though I am over 50% Native myself. But since you aren't doing this for profit, I don't see where you would be harming them, or their income, in any way. Some tribes ARE very protective of all their work, be it religious, or not, though. There is a lot of bitterness (understandably), & a tribe that lost 90% of it's people to infection would have a pretty good reason;o)

If the Ponkapoag still refuse your request, I'm sure you won't have any problem finding another tribe that would feel honored. There are SO many tribes out there with very little or no recognition (I think that's so cool that you want to do a less known tribe:o); I have quite a few books from my studies on this, I could look some up for you, if you need:o) I do agree, a beaded collection without the Native Americans would feel like it was missing something.

If you are over 50%, then you have more genetic indigenous American ancestry than most on any reservation. Many tribes recognize up to 7th generation (1/128 or 8%).

Kathy,

I'm native American and I can certainly understand the tribe's initial concerns. However, you are doing this to honor the NA culture and I think that your heart is in the right place. I would definitely like to see the other work you've been doing.

Maybe the tribe thought their reasons were valid based on some beliefs that I myself have. There have been far too many people taking advantage of the native American designs and using them for commercial gains. My DH and I never purchase any NA stuff from white folks. Period. We feel the money should stay in NA hands and that the middle men are taking too much of the profits out of NA hands. (This is just our opinion.) I hate to see the people suffer as they do. DH and I were raised in a white man's world and had the advantages that many on the reservations do not.

Keep up the good work Kathy. Your heart is in the right place, and if you ever want to work on Choctaw designs let me know.

Starlia

Louise is correct. However, some tribes do not recognize anything but 100%. My tribe, the Choctaw, recognize any lineage as long as it can be proved.

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Louis Cage" :

]Many tribes recognize up to 7th generation (1/128 or 8%)

shoot - in that case, i do qualify! for my daughter, i believe the recognition stops with her, on her father's side.

If you want any help, I've done extensive research for both my sister and I on the Choctaw side and on her children's side as well from their father.

Starlia

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "starlia" :

]If you want any help, I've done extensive research for both my sister and I ]on the Choctaw side and on her children's side as well from their father.

well, for my daughter, everything is well documented. her grandmother was the daughter of a Tuscarora [sp?] chief in the Niagara Falls area. She has the beadwork the chief's descendants gave me for her before she was born.

on my side, through my father, i have a copy of the lady's picture. one look at the picture leaves no doubt - - i just haven't been able to find anyone who knew the lady's name. there is no date on the formal portrait, but it had to be right around the time those things started being made, it's that old. it wasn't something my grandmother talked a lot about - just that we were part Cherokee. it's interesting family history, but not vital to anyone. maybe it explains my long-time fascination with dreamcatchers and beadwork in general, tho.

I understand why your grandmother didn't talk about being Indian in her days. My grandmother was the same way. Being Indian in the late 1800s and early 1900s was worse than being a black person to a lot of people. Most folks blamed the Indians for war and death. My grandmother told us we were Indian, but that I would pass as white and never tell anyone. Can you imagine? I have no idea what they went through in those days to be so afraid or ashamed of who they were.

Being Cherokee is great (explain later) and easy to get a card. You will need the birth information of your NA ancestors. Once you are registered your daughter can become registered with your lineage. Does that make sense?

Now the reason I said being Cherokee was great because the benefits are wonderful! My newphews are all Cherokee and Choctaw, but never knew it until recently. While doing the necessary research the benefits the Cherokees get monthly are huge because of the casinos all over. My nephews now get part of the proceeds and that really helps my sister and her family. My sister's father is Cherokee too so she never knew she was elligible until I told her about Pop.

Email me offline if you need more info. My email address is sklopman at cox-internet dot com or starlia_klopman at dell dot com.

Starlia

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "starlia" :

]Being Cherokee is great (explain later) and easy to get a card. You will ]need the birth information of your NA ancestors. Once you are registered ]your daughter can become registered with your lineage. Does that make ]sense?

it makes sense, if i had it. my father was never able to find most of it for some reason - it's all buried in Missouri somewhere.

but aside from that, i wouldn't try to get money for it - it's just interesting historical information to us. i do understand my grandmother's attitude somewhat - knowing her. and it's a shame that they picked up all of those attitudes.

[we're talking two different daughters here] oldest daughter's great-grandmother was very proud of being the eldest daughter of the chief - but also very bitter about being denied everything because she was a girl. it was one reason her grandmother sent her away from the reservation to get an education. she was a very delightful lady all the years i knew her, and oldest daughter adored her.

Yep, this is what my family is STILL going through. My great grandmother on my mom's side was full Cherokee; she was one of those rare, wonderful, women that always stood up for herself, spoke her mind, and had the "I don't need no one!" kinda attitude:o) We have all these great stories, recipes, and ways of doing things, from her. Our family is also ridiculously superstitious, thanks to her;o) BUT, many of the older members of my family still deny it to this day; when I went back for a family reunion a couple years ago, I mentioned our heritage, and the whole place stopped, helped their breath, and looked to my great aunt for her response...which was "don't ever let anyone hear you say that; I won't have a kid messing up what I've built here". Definitely shocked me! We still have family members living on reservations! I didn't know it was supposed to be some big secret;o)

My great g-ma taught us to always make sure there is a flaw in our beadwork; perfection can only exist in God, and to try to imitate that perfection would be arrogant and presumptuous, inviting evil spirits into the piece. So, if we get near the end of a piece, and haven't messed up at all, *make* a mistake. (Doesn't mesh with *my* beliefs, but it was an interesting tidbit I thought I'd share:o)

I did mess it up...I'm 1/4 Sioux, and 1/8 each Choctaw and Cherokee. My grandmother on my dad's side is full Sioux, and my great grandmother on my mom's side was full Cherokee. I can't remember where the Choctaw is, though I know it's on my dad's side (my grandfather, IIRC, though I also remember him talking of his Irish heritage, so I'm not sure). I have it all in a huge genealogy book stashed away somewhere. I don't claim any of the benefits I could, because I don't need it, and I can't stand to take money that I don't really need, knowing that there are others out there that DO really need it.

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Kyla" :

]My great g-ma taught us to always make sure there is a flaw in our beadwork; ]perfection can only exist in God, and to try to imitate that perfection ]would be arrogant and presumptuous, inviting evil spirits into the piece.

yes, i've heard that one, too.

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

's not what you take, when you leave this world behind you;it's what you leave behind you when you go. -- Randy Travis

The money is not a reason for me either. My sister needed the funds. However, part of the funds go to my nephews college education. It makes sense to use it for the children.

I don't want any of the benefits, except that I want my pieces shown at NA stores. You must show proof of being NA and having the cards are the only way.

My g'ma also told me that God is the only perfect being and that if we haven't messed up then we should. Arrogance was bad.

I'm not shocked by your aunt's reaction. That's exactly how Nannie would have handled the situation. It's just sad to think they don't want to be part of their heritage. I never learned Choctaw, but Nannie was fluent. It's just a shame.

I do that, for that reason. Though there's almost always a flaw that comes along to do the job all on its own. Sarajane

Sarajane's Polymer Clay Gallery