A question for lampworkers

For me, the difficulty level directly effects the price of the bead. Different artists will have different answers about what's difficult for them. For me, the most time consuming, difficult beads are beads which have patterns or florals that are encased. The more times the bead has to be encased over a pattern, the tougher it is. Also, any bead that needs to be shaped has a higher difficulty rating than a round bead for me. Bicones are the hardest shape for me to do, mostly because I hardly do them. For some, bicones and encasing are easier. Some beads take a lot of time, but aren't necessarily difficult. If a bead has a lot of twists or swirled patterns, it takes time, but for me those are easier because I do them a lot. Same with raised florals. The more flowers on a bead, the more time. Also, sometimes the color of glass I am using will effect the difficulty. Different glass works in different ways, and some colors are really hard to work with, even though they are beautiful. So basically, this is a tough question to answer. :)

Hi Diana.

I'll answer this for me, as everyone finds difficulty in different things.

I would say that encased florals would have to be the hardest for me because there are just so many steps. Add more color layers to the petals and it's even that much more difficult and time consuming. The bigger the bead, the more time it takes to get everything molten too, so that is $$.

Precise, raised, scrolling stringer work can be a stinker too since you have to leave it raised enough without it popping off. Raised straight lines are a breeze for me.

Well placed, even sized dots are easy for me. Frit beads are easy for me, if you don't count the playing it takes to find what colors don't have icky reactions.

Symmetric shapes other than round or donuts can be difficult because you work agains the natural tendency of the molten glass to be round.

Realistic sculpture (frogs, dogs, faces, etc). For me...forget it. Murrini? No way. Then we get into certain colors. Purple 254 (evil purple), silver pink? I love to hate those sometimes.

Pricing should be based on the time involved, experience, and materials. I'm finding more and more these days that I can only get the effects I want with the more expensive glasses. Buyers may not realize that some glass costs more (way more) to use than others. The difference can be $8 a pound to $50 a pound for moretti colors. Colors like Ink Blue, Rubino Oro (Gold Pink), Copper Green, Intense Black, Opal Yellow, a few of the pinks, tans and a handful of others, will make a higher priced bead if used in larger amounts. Silver in a bead also makes it more time consuming and more expensive. I would guess dichro does the same.

Just some of my thoughts.

As with Lori and Kandice I'm going to answer for myself, although they hit on a lot of things that makes it time consuming for me.

I really hated encased florals because they are a pain to do well. The more I do the easier they become. However, I pull very thick stringer to encase instead of using a rod. The pulling of all the stringer takes time. This is the same with the flowers. You must pull your stringer before starting to make a bead.

I love sculptural beads and they are a breeze for me. I don't do a lot of them right now because I'm working on other things to build my skill set. A lot of folks would really argue that sculpturals are harder for them.

I don't think anyone mentioned that some beads have layers and layers of color on them. Corina usually does beads with two layers of encasing with different colors to get most of her effects. If you look at her purples she uses EDP, then medium purple, and lastly light purple to get those really sparkling beads. That takes time.

Then there are those beads that have tons of stuff going on inside them. Tink's beads are a wonderful example. You can't tell in the photos, but she has a whole world going through a bead before it's even encased. Those are very hard for me to do.

Bicones are another thing that I don't do well and they take a lot of time. I'm working on it though. Flowers with dimension sitting on top of the bead take a lot of time because you have to create the stringer first. Most times it's a base of opaque color, encased with a transparent color or two, then adding stripes along the sides. Then pulling it into the right thickness.

Hope that helps some.

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Kandice Seeber" :

]Also, sometimes the color of glass I am using will effect the difficulty.

EDP, Kandice???

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

Thank you all... I am getting a clearer idea of which embellishments are harder and why... Im trying to understand the pricing of beads. Its a fairly obvious equation on the face of things: the more time, the more glass, the more expensive the glass and the trickier the technique is to master the higher priced the bead must be. I imagine that each artist could quantify those elements somehow, maybe some have, to get a rough idea of the cost to make a bead. Then comes the trickier part. How much will someone be willing to pay for that particular bead? If I may go back to the example of the beads Sooz posted, from all you *plural ya'lls* have described the surface design on a clear bead is not the most challenging design and yet someone may be willing to pay more for that than an equally well executed bead made of the most expensive and testy types of glass. How do you figure that into your equations? I do enjoy reading the steps it takes to create the beautiful beads you make. I used to gasp when I looked at the auctions final prices and now I just watch and applaud when they go nice and high. Another bonus is learning to see the difference between well done and medium. Diana

Yep, and (sob!) I am addicted to the expensive colors!

I don't use EDP. Ever. I bought my first rod of it recently and still haven't used it. LOL I'm skkkeeeeeeered!! Hehehe

Striking colors are harder to use. I use a lot of gold pink (rubino) so I am used to its quirkiniess. Same with silver pink, opal yellow and streaky pink. I hate ivory and dark turquoise because of the way they react. I also have a hard time with some of the opaque newer colors because they spread out like nobody's business and eat up any color that is applied directly to them.

Some people just do not realize how much goes into making these beads. It's hard to describe in words.

The more expensive colors tend to be more popular with buyers, because the colors are really spectacular. So buyers tend to go ahead and pay more for the really gorgeous stuff. Ink blue, dark lavender, gold pink, silver pink, opal yellow, copper green, etc. are all more expensive because they are handpulled and some contain precious metals - people love these colors in beads. I have never had any problems justifying my prices. Never. Not one time. I've been told countless times to increase them. And I did when things were getting out of hand and I couldn't keep up. Didn't help. People still wanted the beads, even at higher prices. Dammit, I sould like such a snob, but it's true. There's something also about lampwork that you just cannot quantify or put into a formula, and that's the artistic side. Pricing is hard, and I admit that sometimes I just fly by the seat of my pants. But I have never had anyone tell me that my stuff is not worth the price. I have had people tell me that they can't afford my stuff, but that's common no matter what you make. But there are always people in line behind the people that can't afford it. I really wish I could make beads and sell them for cheap to people who can't afford the expensive stuff. But I can't afford that myself. There's too much work involved in this craft to do that. Instead I have the weekly giveaway, and I sometimes donate beads to charity and such. Then there are BFNR's. I do those when I can.

Hi Diana! For me that would be any kind of sculptural. Don't like 'em, don't do 'em. :) I DO admire the work of others, however.

Encasing stuff always takes ME (at least) a lot of time... mainly because it has to be absolutely perfect, otherwise into the water bucket it goes. Starting over 4 or 5 times takes time, you know! Lol!

I know the lovely Melinda Melanson has lots of tutorials on her website. Haven't been there in a while, so I don't know what's new, but worth a look if you're interested:

I'm probably one of the very few who doesn't fret over prices, regardless of difficulty. Sure, I like to be able to cover expenses, that's why I set a minimum price for my auctions. But to be perfectly honest I'm just as thrilled to sell a set for $10 as I am to sell a set for $100.

Perhaps if I had to make a living doing this, I'd feel differently, but fortunately I don't have to. I do it for the sheer pleasure of doing it, and because I get such a kick out of watching the glass do its thing. And I probably would still do it if I never sold a thing.

Wow, so after all that babbling, I guess my answer to your question is, it doesn't! :)

Kandice, I hope I didnt give the impression that I wanted anyone to justify the price of their beads. Nooooo... I rejoice when I see one of RCB's artists auctions going high. I dont mind that they are out of my price range at this point. Someday, perhaps, they wont be. I want every artist who loves what they are doing as much as you and every other bead artist whose joy shows so obviously in their work to get paid scad loads of money so you can keep on doing it! Im just a curious soul... I love to ask questions. There is no need *ever* for an artist to justify a price they set on their work. Thats what the consumer might do.. justify the price they pay*, but to me the artist is free to set any price they want to and its up to the consumer to decide if that object is worth that price. Hugs Diana

Oh, I completely understand. :) I never thought you implied that. I just get the feeling that when some buyers talk about being able to buy beads for really low, they are asking for those of us who sell higher to justify that, or to sell lower because others do. So much goes into the pricing that it's really hard to compare everyone. And the artistic factor cannot be compared. No two lampworkers are going to give you the same answer. It may be difficult for you as the querant to get the answers you need because this is an art and is difficult to quantify.

Thank you for the link and your thoughts on the subject. Im trying to gain a greater appreciation for all the things lampworkers do. Its harder to see the work involved in a bead that looks as tho it was born, not made. In other words... there are artists who make the process look effortless. Diana

I totally agree with this. :) There are several artists who I am in awe of.

vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Kandice Seeber" :

]I don't use EDP. Ever.

yes. that was what i meant, doll.

----------- @vicki [SnuggleWench] (Books)

:D

I went to that site... took a look at the tutorials... I learned a lot. Thing is tho, that even knowing what I know now I still dont know how ya'll do it. :-) Maybe thats the definition of true art.. the artist makes it look easy... they seem to not be visible in the process. Does that make sense? Some of the beads the RCB artists do leave me feeling that way. Some of yours, even. ;-) Diana

I certainly never expected the artists to justify their prices.

Cheers, Carla

Kandice Seeber wrote: