What are the Ashes

Oh, I love a trophy (so to speak) with deep meaning! North American professional hockey has the Stanley Cup which gets the same level of reverence you'd expect for the Holy Grail! lol

Caryn

But that didn't keep ESPN from running a commercial where the Stanley Cup was used as a Jell-O mold. I thought that was a hoot!

Personal favorite trophy is Floyd of Rosedale--a trophy of a pig which goes to the winner of the Iowa/Minnesota college football game. This dates back to a contest between the two state governors in 1935. In that year a champion hog (the brother of Blue Boy from the movie State Fair) from Rosedale Farms went to St. Paul after Minnesota won the game. The hog was dubbed Floyd after Minnesota governor Floyd B. Olson. Since a live hog is an unwieldy travelling companion, a bronze sculpture was soon commissioned and it has gone to the winner ever since.

There are t> Oh, I love a trophy (so to speak) with deep meaning! North American

Yes, and it should also be said that Australia has had the Ashes for the past 18 years, so I suppose it's about time the Brits got it back - for a very short while! Much was shown on the TV news here of the huge celebrations in London, and good luck to them. They need that kind of good feeling after the bomb attack. John (in Oz)

But of course :) - and did you hear that outgoing Governor-General Adrienne Clarkson is going to create a trophy for Women's hockey. following in the illustrious footsteps of her predecessor Governor-General Lord Stanley?

I think it's a lovely idea - I just wonder what sort of trophy she'll choose - considering her interest and support of Inuit culture, it might very well be some sort of carving.

Marg

I hadn't heard that - great idea!

Maybe Pat P. and others from the UK might like to comment, but when I viewed the images from Trafalgar Square, I saw very few Union Jacks, but a lot of the Cross of St. George. Also nothing of the National Anthem, but things like Land of Hope and Glory. I get the impression that the English want a country called England, separate from, and different from, the United Kingdom. Is this a false impression? If not, does it say something about trying to join different "peoples" together, when they have differences, e.g. Iraq?

-- Jim Cripwell. A volante tribe of bards on earth are found,/ who, while the flattering zephyrs round them play,/ on "coignes of vantage" build their nests of clay;/ how quickly from that aery hold unbound,/ dust for oblivion!/ To the solid ground/ of nature trusts the mind that builds for aye. Wordsworth.

Jim,

It's always been obvious that while they are the United Kingdom, each piece has extreme pride in their original country. The Welsh, the Scots, the English, the Northern Irish all have a national pride. And why shouldn't they? Each area has amazing history, each had their own kings and heros over the centuries.

In the U.S. each state has it's local pride as well, we don't have the history that the U.K. does, but we still feel like our state is the best to be from. I'm sure it's the same in Canada.

Caryn

Jim Cripwell.

Dead right, Jim, the cross of St Gorge is seen much more now. But haven`t you seen the Scottish Saltire and the Welsh Dragon and the "wearing of the green" at Rugby matches too? We`re all British, but still retain our seperate national identities and traditions on occasions like this.

Land of Hope and Glory has been far more popular than the National Anthem for ages! Possibly because a lot of us think that the National Anthem should be rewoded "God HELP the Queen"

John has a small flag of St George badge on the back of the car - with my grandmother originating in Edinburgh, I should really have a saltire on my side of it, but still!

Scotland and Wales are now quite clearly "seperate" from England. But I can`t see us ever going to war with them! Been there, done that, and have several teeshirts! ;))

Pat P

I have seen Pat. P's answer, and I think your comments dont quite come to grips with the situation. I cannot imagine any gathering in the USA where Old Glory was not the absolute dominant flag. I have always admired the fact that, almost without exception, and no matter what their ancestory, citizens of the USA are Americans first and foremost, and anything else a distant second. Were the same true in Canada!!, but unfortunately our children in school do not swear allegiance to the Maple Leaf every day. In Canada, at such celebrations, the Maple Leaf would dominate

**EXCEPT** on St. Jean Baptiste Day, in the Province of Quebec. There the blue Fleur de Lys would dominate, but, though it might be a close run thing, I venture there would be more Maple Leafs than there were Union Jacks in Trafalgar Square. But St. Jean Baptiste Day is a celebration of Quebec nationalism; the hope that one day there will be a country called Laurentia, separate and distinct from Canada. My interest is the extent to which these feelings exist in the UK.

-- Jim Cripwell. A volante tribe of bards on earth are found,/ who, while the flattering zephyrs round them play,/ on "coignes of vantage" build their nests of clay;/ how quickly from that aery hold unbound,/ dust for oblivion!/ To the solid ground/ of nature trusts the mind that builds for aye. Wordsworth.

Before classes start for the day here in Nova Scotia, the children stand and they sing O Canada. That is good enough, more is reminiscent of Hitler Youth.

I heard she was from Saskatchewan - truly an amazing woman.

Marg Whittleton wrote

Indeed! Three cheers for Adrienne. An Inuit work would be good--and it would certainly be easy to find something with an ice theme. Dawne, looking forward to seeing the trophy here in Saskatchewan, home of Hayley Wickenheiser and other great woman hockey stars

From Shauvavon. There are several women on the current national team from Saskatchewan as well. Besides being able to see for miles, our long flat prairies apparently encourage on to skate for miles. Hayley is pretty awesome--it is wonderful to see girls taking her as a hero. Dawne

"Lucretia Borgia" >

Here too--Oh Canada, the bilingual version (and in some cases, the feminist version --a girl here has made it her Sask centennial project to make that change). We should care more about the people of our country than about any symbol. Dawne

Yes, but don`t forget, Jim, England, Scotland Wales and part of Ireland have only been united for a few hundred years - (a short time as far as our history goes) not long enough to feel COMPLETELY as one between ourselves - but CERTAINLY United if anyone else tries to have a go at us! Like a family - we`ll argue amongst ourselves, but just let an outsider start anything and watch out!

Pat P

DD would be thrilled!

Now - how would I contact Ms. Wickenheiser for an autograph?

Cheryl

DD came home with Tshirts from Ireland and England, but not Scotland....which just figures as the girl is mostly Scottish! ROFL

Girl has no sense of genetic pride!

Caryn (wondering what I did wrong with that one....no Scotland T-shirts, vegetarian, eats beans at breakfast....)

I've had a day to think about your response.

Clearly, you chose to miss my point completely. The States and Provinces don't have the same pride that Scotland, Wales, England, Ireland have, because they were never separate countries. I never said they did, I merely tried to point out the common belief in all humans that where ever they come from is the best. It's called ethnocentrism.

Anybody who has managed to not realize that the parts of the U.K. have intense pride in their heritages hasn't been paying any attention! With their diverse histories, having been at war with each other for centuries before they were united, it's no wonder their ethnocentrism is much stronger than what we have in North America. I made that point, in different words, as well.

Caryn