OTOT fashion whine

This is being a wonderful thread in general. I learned to sew in junior high Home Ec. class. Then took one year of High School Home Ec. Started making my own clothes then, and have ever since. It is very fortunate that I do because I have a very strangely proportioned body. A lot of people are one size on top and another on the bottom, I am also different sizes side t side and front to back. And having been in stores, I am glad that I can make my own clothes. The quality of workmanship, fabric and such is so bad. Then the prices.... OMG. That is crazy. However I do buy "tops" when they mark them down at K-Mart or Target. I can usually find a few knit tops that fit okay and are cheaper on sale/clearance than buying the fabric would be.

Best thing to do.... email or write each store. Customer service is fine, but try to copy to higher ups. The more the better. Tell them that you were in shopping for whatever it was. That you couldn't find anything and are upset about the lack of choice. etc. Keep it brief, check your spelling and be sure to tell them what you *are* looking for. If the higher ups don't know, they will keep on carrying the stuff that sells. Which is the stuff worn by "rock stars" and whoever is in the news/ making "news" and so on. Try some of the lesser known shops, or ones that you might not have tried. Compliment them if you find stuff you like. Let them know.

Good luck with all of it.

Pati, > It has always been difficult to be a junior high size - at 18, 21, 41, 61

If we can ever manage a big RCTQ retreat I will volunteer to help anyone who needs the help with how to do pattern alteration for you. If you can get a good basic well fitting bodice pattern, you can use that to alter any other pattern you buy. Not really difficult to do, but needs visuals if at all possible.

For those of you who are making, or thinking of making the attempt to sew some clothes for yourself, may I offer a few tips??

1. Buy the correct size pattern. This means understanding some things about clothing patterns in general. A. Most patterns are designed for a "B" cup size. If you are drastically different you need to change where you measure and plan to adjust the pattern to fit. There are a few patterns that are now available with different front bodice patterns for different cup sizes. They may help. B. If you are smaller than a "B" cup, you will take in the pattern a bit, and make the front a bit smaller. Or ignore it. (Or wear a padded bra, your choice ) C. If you are larger, you will need to buy your pattern by the "High Bust" measurement, up under your armpits and across the top of your chest/back. This size will fit you better in the shoulder/neck area. Then you will do a "Full Bust" adjustment on the pattern.

Always buy according to the measurement/size chart in the pattern book. Do not think that you can buy the same size pattern as you buy ready to wear because you can't, usually. RTW sizing has no uniformity at all. A size 12 in one store might be a size 10 or 14 in another store. The major pattern companies have all agreed to use a standard sizing chart. The amount of ease they add will vary from pattern to pattern but they start with the same basic size measurements.

1. If you can, get help to take your measurements. The first thing you will do after you have all your pattern pieces selected and cut apart/pressed is compare measurements. The more places you have to compare, the more accurate you can be.

1. Make pattern adjustments. Use paper first aid tape and wrapping tissue to fill in where you need to "cut and spread" for more room. Paper tape can be pressed, can be written on and before it is really pressed firmly to the tissue can be carefully lifted off and repositioned if you need to. It is also somewhat translucent like tissue paper. ()

2. Make up a "muslin". Use old sheets, cheap fabric, whatever. It helps if it is similar in weight to what you will be making the final garment of. You don't have to add facings/interfacings/ etc. to the muslin. It is to check fit. Stay stitch on the seam line along neck and such to keep it from stretching out. Making the muslin from muslin or a solid fabric means you can actually mark on the fabric where you need to make, or do make, changes. Make your seam allowances on the muslin 1" wide. Use a longer than normal stitch to put it together and try on. Once the muslin fits, make all those changes to your pattern. keep the muslin to check the next time you make up the same pattern. Or to check against another similar pattern.

Yes this all takes some time. But the results are well worth it. And once you know the basics of what alterations you need to make for yourself, it goes much faster. I know that I have to either add to the bust dart, or create one to add at least 3" in length to the bodice front, plus add about 2-3 inches to the front plus add to the side seams front, back and sleeves. I also need to lower the bust dart (and my measurements are written on my cutting board, one of the cardboard ones). For skirts I also have the changes I need to make noted on my cardboard mat. And I will shorten any dress/skirt by several inches, unless they are designed as a "mini skirt", in which case they may be just about right or need and inch or so of length added. sigh. This all takes me about half an hour or so, but then I am good to go. And I know that it will fit.

Have fun, please feel free to ask any questions you have, either here or e-mail me if you want something specific.

Have fun, Pati, in Phx

Hanne Gottliebsen wrote:

We lived in Korea, which is apparently the most racially homogenous country in the world, they aren't all exactly the same size and shape, but it's surprising how close the sizes were and thus what a narrow range clothes were available in, an awful lot was one size fits all, including things like bras! I was pregnant at the time, I'd taken all the maternity clothes I owned, which was very few and Korea is very cold in winter and I really had to get some warmer trousers. To my surprise the one size fits all maternity clothes did actually fit me, I'm a different shape to the average Korean woman, being a pear rather than an apple, but I guess my hips actually weren't any wider, just my waist narrower. The service of a tailor would definitely have had to have been engaged had we been there any longer. We also got lucky buying clothes and nappies for my son, he's 100% British, but an anomoly in shape and size, the same brands of nappies are shaped differently in Korea and they fit much better and I didn't have to safety pin his clothes to get them to stay on!

I buy most of my clothes from Norstrom Rack, I know some people find that very frustrating and I would tend to agree, but if I go there I have a reasonable chance of finding things that fit, which doesn't happen most places, other that places like Macy's and Norstrom and nice though it is to say ooh, I like that top and be able to get it in whichever size and colour you want, the prices don't allow that to happen frequently. I vastly prefer high waist trousers for comfort and I do seem to be able to find them there. Tops do seem to be low cut at the moment, but then layering seems to be the fashion too, which works in winter, but I'm realising I don't have much for summer.

Cheers Anne

Me too, well skinny and young by some definitions, but 2 kids means that skinny doesn't actually look good if skin is revealed, no longer stretched stretch marks are about the worst look possible! So I have to make sure things get covered in the middle, which isn't always easy. The layered style that is ok at the moment really suits me, I like to be able to take layers off as I change locations, but my underneath layer is strappy and I know that won't look good forever!

Cheers Anne

Home Ec was there......I was focused on college entrance courses and ignored it. I took science and language courses. Home Ec was looked upon the same as basket weaving courses for college athletes. I am a good to excellent homemaker, cook, and seamstress and never took a class in school. Life taught me more in this area than any classroom could IMO

In school in Denmark (the 80's, but afaik still going on), I had home ec (really, cooking and cleaning) for one year, textiles (sewing, knitting, embroidery etc) for one year and woodwork for one year. I did optional textiles for another couple of years after that.

In each case it was 2-3 hours a week for the full school year. Enough that if you paid a little attention, you learnt the basics. In cookery, we did some theory every week (nutrition, health/safety etc) and then cooked and cleaned up. With the cooking there was usually a particular skill involved. Of course, I also remember having to clean out the disgusting fridge!

I still have some of the items I made in both sewing and woodwork class. We did make some clothing items, but funds was a serious issue for that. One smart thing my school did: the sewing class was the year before the cooking class, and towards the end of the sewing classes, we all made aprons. These aprons never went home that summer - they went straight to the class cupboard in the kitchen classroom for use while cooking. Everyone had an apron, and they were ours, so we looked after them well.

I remember fondly how much we used to just enjoy chatting along while working, and somehow the usual cliques did not matter - I guess because mostly none of us knew what we were doing. It was great talking practice for the 3 refugees who joined my class at that time too.

It is a real shame that we just don't take the time (and money) to provide this for the kids now. Even if you don't learn to be _good_ at sewing, cooking, whatever, if you know more or less what you are doing, you can handle the basics, right? Grown ups who think (really!) they can't sew on a button almost makes me want to dry. And I know people like that, and it's not because they are lazy or afraid to try new things. They just have no clue where to even start.

Enough of my rambling.

Hanne in London

Pati Cook wrote:

Back in the Dark Ages when I was in school, Home Ec seemed a pointless waste of time, since I could already make most of my clothes and cook everything they planned to teach us. Girls didn't do wood or metal shop back then, which would have interested me.

But you are absolutely right, this is essential knowledge, and many parents no longer know enough to teach their children. A local charity helps low-income children with school work (their parents are sometimes illiterate), and with finding entry-level jobs when they finish school. The director said one of the first things they do with a new group of kids is teach them how to eat a balanced meal on a plate with a knife and fork, sitting at a table. Many of them lack even this most basic skill! They also learn how to dress for a job interview, how to make eye contact, how to shop and interact in a store, how to wash themselves and care for their clothing, etc. Roberta in D

"Pati Cook" schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:yrednTF_morYQ7HVnZ2dnUVZ snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.com...

Pati,

I might just have to try again (haven't really done clothes sewing since I did basic outdoor stuff as a teenager). You make it sound doable - do you give lessons?

OTOH, it would take time away from quilting :-(

Hanne > If we can ever manage a big RCTQ retreat I will volunteer to help anyone

I do give lessons. Love to teach and help folks learn how to have fun with fabric, needle and thread. While making clothes can take time away from quilting it really isn't any more time consuming than shopping for clothes. Plus, if you use cotton fabric (or even other fabrics, depending....) you can use the excess for quilting. (Gee, what a concept... make a shirt and use the leftover bits and pieces to make a quilt. ) And with the price of gas and ready to wear clothes, even with higher prices on good quality fabric, it really isn't more expensive. (Yes I am an enabler. I firmly believe that most anyone who really wants to sew can. Some take a bit longer to get comfortable with it, and it does mean taking it step by step and slowing down some at the beginning, but it can work.

Pati, > Pati,

Oh my! I had seen a report on this "dress" on TV news. I did not read any of the text around the photo that I posted the link to. I do think the poor girl suffers from a bad case of poor taste, but I have no desire to engage in name calling regarding her or her dress.

Rita L.

Polly Esther wrote:

OK, I will definitely put this back on my list now. I do have to figure out a way to learn to fit patterns though. Definitely not a b-cup!

I wonder if I can get an elderly relative to help - she always did wonderful clothes sewing (tailored jacket, anyone?).

Hanne in London

Pati Cook wrote:

'zactly.......i think....

amy in CNY

This is something that really bothers us. It seem the younger generation (meaning my son's age group-30+) never eats a meal at the table. Usually in the living room in front of the TV. And usually not all the family at the same time. The DGS's called us "old fashioned" once because we eat all meals at the table. Of course, we got a kick out of that statement---we waited a long time to be old-fashioned! However, if anyone tries to sit at their place at our table for a meal, that person is quickly told "that's my place-you can't sit there". They really enjoy eating at the table and having us all together. The oldest said he wished his family did this more often, but "our table is just for holding mail and junk." Sad. Gen

Hey, don't tar us all with the same brush, the rates of sitting down eating dinner at the table may be going down, but there are still hordes of us doing it, it's just not quite such a big horde! Our table does hold mail and junk, but we eat round it, not great, I know and if we have a real junk disaster, we eat Asian style, we get out a low folding table and sit round it on the floor, it get's folded up and put away before it can get covered in junk! I'm

A note--our guild started a program in co operation with the public and private schools. A go getter filed papers for tax exempt and applied for grants. Got all that were offered and also got sponsors from The Warm Company, YLI threads and Janome. Last year there were 1,000 students and waiting room only. Actually over 1000. Then the teachers got involved and requested classes for themselves. Very successful. Such fun to watch the kids run the machines. Girls very precise, boys careful but in love with making that machine run. Anna Belle

I'm going to really date myself here... DS#1 is almost 30 now. I was appalled at what passed for Home Ec in Jr. High when he was there. They had co-ed Home-Ec and Shop, didn't spend enough time at anything.Their sewing projects were made of felt and fun-fur. I don't think he finished any of them, and it didn't matter. He "learned" how to make mac & cheese from a box in cooking, and a grilled cheese sandwich. I went to a prosperous jr. high school with a cooking lab and a sewing lab with enough machines. I had Home Ec for 2 1/2 years, 8th, 9th, & 10th grade; the first 2 were 1/2 year of sewing & 1/2 year of cooking. Sewing started with a cloth sample book with some basic hand stitching (running stitch, catch stitch, hem stitch, and blanket stitch are what I remember) and open seams, flat felled seams, and French seams. Then we each made a simple apron with a pocket, then an A-line skirt with a zipper. The next year we made a shirt or blouse that buttoned and a lined wool skirt and a dress. I don't think anyone made slacks-we weren't allowed to wear them at school. Nobody even mentioned quilting.

In the cooking half we made what was then standard home-ec food. Spinach Timbales, Tuna croquettes, muffins, a salad with oil&vinegar dressing, cream of tomato soup, ham loaf, a cake from scratch. (There were 4 boys in the second year who were in VO-ED for restaurant jobs. They did some classes at the same time as us girls, but they made a steak & lobster dinner with all the trimmings. Can we say envy?) We had to plan a nutritious meal, and we learned a little about presentation. Our meals had to be balanced & fit a budget. The 3rd year we did "Family Living" for half a year- budgeting, how to manage a checking account, how to read a lease, figuring the cost of interest on a short term loan and a mortgage, and a limited amount of sex ed. We did not learn child care, or figure expense of having a child, how to do laundry, clean a house, or how to apply for a job, which at my age I think would have been pretty relevant and could have filled the other half a year. I think the other half a year I had to take typing. I'm still a two finger typist.

In Shop the boys made a project or two from wood, learned how to wire a lamp, and learned some automotive stuff like oil changes & changing a flat tire the first year, and the second year they built a piece of furniture, and more car repair. I think my brother took drafting the third year.

Jane in NE Ohio-

I did home ec at school too, I think we did more than most schools, but as far as I know they are still carrying on. Just thinking back what it covered, we rotated through 6 subjects, Art, Ceramics, Textiles, Food, Design & Technology and IT, yes, IT was in there, I bet it isn't any more! To be honest we didn't learn anywhere near as much as would be desirable and the focus then was oriented to problem solving and designing solutions, which is all very well,

Home Ec does not exist as it once was. It is now Family and Consumer Science (FACS). In order to keep any program alive the content had to change to be more relevant for the late 80's and 90's. The working woman or man no longer has the time to sew a garment or maybe prepare food from scratch. The economics of running a home, time and money are very important. A major emphasis on careers, families, children & finances. We no longer teach many topics that were taught 30 years ago. Long gone are the fancy meals, making garments, planning your wedding, sewing machines often are not part of the department. clothing construction classes are no longer taught in the university preparation for a FACS teaching. The programs are not "sitichin and sewin"

FACS is very co-ed title 19 changed a lot of the rules about not letting girls and guys take the same classes. The FACS programs now have to justify what they teach in the math, science, and reading areas. What used to be called FHA (Future Homemakers of America) is now Family, Career and Community Leaders of America (FCCLA). If programs did not make the change, enrollment went and so did the classes, Now the programs are being cut to add more classes to meet the NO Child Left Behind requirments

Audrey Retired Family Consumer Science teacher, 33 years program cut at the middle school because of no child left behind

I had a year of Home Ec as a Freshman in High School. We made aprons that were kind of cute, blue gingham with a white rick rack line crossing over the front to resemble a clothesline. Then we designed and appliqued tiny items of clothing hanging on the line. Next we made skirts and jumpers so we could learn to do zippers. I remember the teacher measuring us, top, middle and bottom for the patterns, then yelling the bust measurements out loud before she wrote them down in her little notebook. One girl was so mortified that everyone now knew her bust measurement (really tiny) that she locked herself in the storage closet and the janitor had to get her out. We had to actually wear the items we made to school to get our grade on them.

When we learned to cook, we had to make a meal and serve it to the boys' shop class.

When we learned how to do hair and makeup, I had a head full of rollers and the fire alarm went off. I had to run out looking like a martian.

It was a fun year.

Denise