Quilt class dilemma

I went to the NJ Quilt Fest yesterday as I do every year. Last year I bought a needle punch kit complete with fabric, pattern, and threads. Then of course I needed the special needle and a hoop. A pretty hefty investment for a craft I had not done before. The pattern I purchased was a Goose in the Pond block and only uses two colors so I thought it would make a good travel project since the finished size is a 7 inch block. I didn't start the project due to other priorities and basically forgot about it until I saw the brochure for this years show. I looked at the classes and saw a needle punch class - just what I needed, I thought. It was 3 hours and all I needed to bring was a pen or pencil to take notes and snippers. The class description clearly indicated "Everything else is supplied". Can you see where I'm going with this?

There were about 20 students at the class when the instructor started to explain what payment types were accepted for the "class kit". The kit was $25 and contained the "special needle" I already had, a small square of weaver's cloth, a small square of iron on interfacing and a pattern of a small heart about 1.5 x 1.5 inches. The kits could be paid for with cash or check. I don't carry lots of cash to shows since I generally use a debit or credit card and I very rarely carry a check book with me anymore. Luckily, I had just enough to cover the cost of the kit.

Everyone made it very clear that the class description said nothing about a kit that was required to be purchased for the class. Some even had the printed page from the website. The instructor had an email that she had sent to the show organizers indicating the contents of the kit but that information never made it into the class description. The organizer said it was her responsibility to proofread the class description and the instructor said it was their responsibility to put into the class description. She got paid and so did the show organizer. The students were the ones that were impacted by an omission they had no control over.

Most of the folks forked over the $25 but several chose to sit through the class to learn what they could without doing the hands on part. Two were visibly upset and even though one left to find an organizer representative, the rep never stepped foot into the classroom. Instead they called the instructor out into the hall and spoke with her privately where they indicated it was her responsibility and not theirs. The instructor apologized profusely but said she could not absorb the cost of the kits.

The instructor also indicated that if she made a big deal out of it with the organizer, she could possibly be taken off the list for future shows because she would be perceived as a problem vendor.

My dilemma is - do I send feedback to the show organizer about my disappointment in the class? I don't want to cause any issues for the instructor since this is her primary source of income. I did learn what I needed to learn to do this technique although the class could have been cut down to 1 hour instead of 3. Most of the class involved personal anecdotes about her life, which while very interesting, weren't the reason I paid for the class. However, my biggest issue is about the required kit that should have been in the class description.

I spent about an hour last night composing an email to the organizer that expressed my disappointment while still indicating that the instructor accomplished the goal of teaching the technique. The email is still in my draft folder. I really don't want this to backlash onto the instructor but I want the organizer to know that I was one of 20 students that were misled by their class description they displayed on their website. I don't think mine will be the only email they get on this topic.

Do I send it or not????

I hate it when this stuff happens, but I will think twice about taking another one of their classes. The class cost $35 plus their added registration fees which brought the cost up to $53 dollars plus the $25 kit. An expensive class in anybodies book methinks. I would not have taken the class if I knew I had to buy the tools again.

AliceW in NJ

Reply to
AliceW
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Not only YES, but HELL YES!

Joan

Reply to
joan8904 in Bellevue Nebraska

I would send the note to the organizer. You appear to have been the victim of fraud, whether intended or not.

Reply to
Mary

Difficult situation, Alice; but my feeling is that the students of the class were the only ones who lost out here. Presumably you also had to pay for the ticket to the show? So, I really do think you must send something.

*If* the instructor was sent a copy of what would appear in the class description, then it really was her responsibility, I'm afraid. Most of the time the organiser's staff (who would be the ones actually putting 'pen to paper' - so to speak), would probably know nothing about the topics of the classes and wouldn't, therefore, have a clue as to whether anything was right or wrong. The organiser *might* know, but couldn't be expected to check the minutiae of the entries.

On the other hand, if the instructor was *not* sent a copy of the class description to check, then it is entirely the responsibility of the organiser, if what she sent to the organiser was not what was 'printed'.

I think it might also be helpful to both parties to say that, although the class was enjoyable and you learnt what you needed to, it did not need as much time as was allocated.

Hope that helps a bit? . In message , AliceW writes

Reply to
Patti

Send your feedback mentioning everything you liked and didn't like about the class. Emphasize your disappointment with not knowing about the required class kit. Keep it factual and unemotional.

Mancuso Brothers put on a great show and do a lot of things right. I've been impressed with their organization and troubleshooting and kindness. However, this problem of the class descriptions not accurately describing the classes, what's needed, and what can be expected, is not a new thing or unique to your experience. It's a place where they keep screwing up. (I don't know if other big shows manage this better.) I don't know if it's the teacher's fault or not, but I do know that Mancuso can't solve the problem if they don't know about, and if they solve it the wrong way (by firing a blameless teacher), that's their fault, not the teacher's.

Some students have taken to bypassing the website and emailing the teachers directly. Then the teachers complain about having to send email individually to the students to answer questions that they thought they'd made plain the first time. It's a big problem.

--Lia

Reply to
Julia Altshuler

Send it Alice. Shame on them. Taria

Reply to
Taria

I did keep the feedback email factual and on point. I was just concerned about the potential impact on the instructor. Knowing now that the organizer has had past problems with classes just corroborates my intention to not take classes unless I can confirm the class requirements. Emailing the instructor is a good idea.

Reply to
AliceW

I think their is errors on both sides here, the instructor is definitely responsible for proof reading, it's only them who knows what it should say, so it's only them that can do it. On the other hand, whether you pay for a kit or not is a basic, like time and date that the organisers should check is correct. To you, the show organisers are the shop front, they are who you should complain to and how they fight that out with the instructor isn't a concern of yours.

Cheers Anne

Reply to
Anne Rogers

Was the email the instructor referred to the only one? Did she perhaps send the information twice, one with class description and one with the added caveat about the kit? If so, the first may have been received and not the second one. And, you have no idea if the email/s sent by instructor got to the proper parties.

Yes, the instructor should have been given a copy to proof before the printing. If not, it falls to the organizer's responsibility for errors/ommissions.

My vote is to send the complaint to the show people and copy to the instructor. And you might mention that you have a network of international quilters who have now heard about this problem, and that the old adage of catching more flies with honey than vinegar definitely applies here.

JMNSHO Ginger in CA

Reply to
Ginger in CA

Unrelated to the coplaints about the class-- Could you tell us who the instructor was? I've never heard of needlepunch and am interested in learning about it and seeing an example.

--Lia

Reply to
Julia Altshuler

Send it. If I read that "Everything else is supplied", I assume that it is included in the fee I have already paid. If I have to pay for supplies, I expect to see the cost of the supplied materials. I would expect that, in general, the supplied materials do not include reusable equipment, such as your special needle. It seems to me that that should have been included in the supply list with a note that it will be available from the instructor for a specified price, because some people may already have it, as you did.

Julia in MN

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AliceW wrote:

Reply to
Julia in MN

This site might help you see:

Reply to
Mystified One

I was thinking about this topic in another direction (while sewing down a binding). This has nothing to do whatsoever with the original discussion, but does bring up another issue/dilemma.

I teach needlepoint. While we sell the equipment in the store, we don't require that students use our recommended needle or hoop. And in just about every class, someone shows up with some odd-ball needle or antique wooden embroidery hoop that absolutely ruins the learning experience for them.

Perhaps we should ask them what equipment they plan to use during the class and make some recommendations. Don't want to scare anyone off, but good tools sure do help!

joan p.s. And don't even get me started on people who bring lousy sewing machines (or machines they've never used ) to sewing classes! :>

Reply to
joan8904 in Bellevue Nebraska

Thanks. I also took a more careful look at the Mancuso site and found Mary Pierson that way.

--Lia

Reply to
Julia Altshuler

Here are some additional helpful sites:

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This one is WOW!!!
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Hope you enjoy the knowledge (and if you decide to try it, remember, you really don't have to shell out a mint for patterns unless you want to...)

Reply to
Mystified One

Good point here, Joan. If I had never done 'needlepoint', I might well not realise that there was a difference between a large-eyed needle - such as a darning needle

- and a blunt tapestry needle. Gosh, if I'd had to learn needlepoint with a pointed needle I'd have thrown in the towel years ago! Something should be said about tools, with the proviso that they can be supplied at a cost. . In message , joan8904 in Bellevue Nebraska writes

Reply to
Patti

Alice: Send the email to both the Mancuso organization AND to the instructor. I just reviewed the class description. The students were mislead, though that may have been a clerical mistake; regardless of the intentions, they bore the brunt of the mistake.

I'd like to point out that the class descriptions were posted far in advance of the event. The instructors can and SHOULD review the on-line and the printed descriptions as soon as published! That little step to review would have 'caught' the error. Did anyone think to remind her of that, or were you all too surprised and upset? So, IMO, some blame does lie with the instructor. She should have at least discounted the supply fee.

Pat in Virginia

Reply to
Pat in Virginia

I don't envy the issues you must encounter as a teacher. I don't mind buying the appropriate equipment especially if it makes me do better at [insert craft activity here] and saves me from buying tools that won't work and just end up being a waste of money.

I mostly attend quilt classes and have been in more than one where a student hadn't even bought the fabric yet (which should have been pre-cut for class) or didn't know how to use a rotary cutter. I give them a lot of credit for taking the class but it really takes away from an even distribution of the teacher's time with each student. Teacher's are angels, IMO!

Reply to
AliceW

I don't know what the entire trail of emails were between the instructor and the organizer but that seems to be the major form of communication since the instructor basically lives in a motor home and travels from show to show. The ball definitely got dropped somewhere along the line. Mary did a nice job with the instruction and I was pleased with my completed hands on project at the end of the day. She is a very "colorful" instructor and did answer every question completely and made sure that everyone understood each step as it was explained. The issue certainly cast a strained shadow over the class, however.

Reply to
AliceW

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Thanks. I think I like the texture more than the patterns. I'd want to add the technique to quilts and wallhangings.

--Lia

Reply to
Julia Altshuler

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