Color: whether you want to know about it or not. (really long)

I've heard about the golden mean and fair curves and I can turn a bowl with a reasonable approach to them. I can proceed thru twenty six grits of sand- paper, then buff from tripoli to carnauba by way of white diamond. I've got wax and oil, lacquer and varnish, detergent and shoe polish. I can draw overlapping leaves on my turnings and dremel them to a fare-the-well. Then why are Andi's bowls basking in the Del Mano while it's iffy if mine will grace the booth between the 4-H pigs and the Future Farmer's goats at the Martin County Fair? It appears that the only thing holding me back from greatness must be color, so I surfed the net to learn all about Andi's colors of Fall, as well as the rest of the year. I'm still barred from the Del Mano, but like any lout with a tiny bit of shallow knowledge, I am compelled to force it on a long suffering rcw. So if all artists, photographers, physicists and anyone else who knows anything at all about color will please leave, I'll try to write a little primer & expose' for the rest of us. Like it or not, colored turnings are here, so we better get with the program.

*********************************************** Color has to do with the wavelength and frequency of light. The colors of a bowl will be perceived according to which wave lengths the bowl absorbs; ie. you don't see the colors of the absorbed waves.The visible wavelengths (colors) make up a spectrum ranging from red to violet (Roy G. Biv) and can be thought of as a clock face with red at 12, yellow at 4, and blue at 8. These are the pure or primary colors, and all the rest are mixtures of them. The so-called secondary colors are mixes of primaries. They are orange (red & yellow) at 2, green (yellow & blue) at 6, and violet (blue & red) at 10. The tertiary colors are mixes of a primary and a secondary color and are named for the mix: red-orange at 1, yellow-orange at 3, yellow-green at 5, green-blue at 7, blue violet at 9 and red-violet at 11. Then there's white, made up of all colors and black with none. That's all you need to know about colors, so you should soon be in the Del Mano. But wait! there's more. If you order today, you also get shades (a color + black), tints (a color + white) and intensity (dull or bright). A bright color contains relatively little gray, while dull colors contain relatively more gray, compared to its pure component. We will also include hues and tones if you order now. A hue is the resultant color that you see, whether pure or a mix. Only women know the names for tones; names such as watermelon, lemonade, etc. Tone depends upon what is mixed with a pure color. A pure color (R,Y,G) has no tone. Everything else has some tone depending on what's mixed up with the pure. (Sociologists and Anthropologists should have left also.) Anyway, this important knowledge about color that I am braying 'ex cathedra' should certainly make you a great wood artist. _Except that I forgot to mention that the colors those miserable critics appreciate vary with the spaces and colors surrounding our masterpieces. Also different kinds of sunlight, light bulbs and retinas of the beholders change viewer's perceptions . We can't win, so let's hear it for pure unadulterated wood grain and pretend not to care about color. That is, if anybody's still awake.;) Arch

Fortiter,

Reply to
Arch
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Hello Arch,

I took it in the intended spirit, I am a sinner in the use of texturing and coloring. My shame will be everlasting. I am sure that I have committed a mortal sin by covering up something that God has created.:) But.... I think that God had a hand in most of the dyes that I use too. :)

No Rules for me, but I am naturally unruly by choice.

Please keep posting Arch, Yours are some of my favorites!!!!

Dave

David Peebles Lyons, Ohio Revolutions Woodturning

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Reply to
Dave Peebles

Hey, Arch -

I didn't take offense to your primer. I do think it's interesting to see how color is being used now in woodturning. When used effectively, coloring the wood can highlight a beautiful grain rather than detract from it. For example, figured maple is an excellent wood that takes color well, and color can showcase some of the subtle grain patterns that might otherwise be missed in the natural wood.

As with any surface enhancement technique in woodturning, the use of color needs to be part of the entire composition of a piece. If a woodturning is ugly prior to the application of color, it will still be ugly after the color is added (and maybe more obviously so).

Understanding how colors work together or against each other is an important tool, also. There are many different resource books in the art section of every bookstore or library that spell out what color combinations work well together. Observers of nature may have already internalized this information, but others may need a little help. For those of you that would prefer to not waste your time reading about color theory, take a close look at plants, insects, reptiles, geology, etc. What pleases your eye from nature will work well in wood art.

And, Arch - I'm glad to know you admire my woodturnings . . .

Reply to
Andi Wolfe

Arch wrote: "I tried to post a light-hearted elementary primer about color as I have tried to do previously about three phase electric power, cutting angles, musings of a COC etc." .....snip......

****************************** And you did exactly that, Arch. No matter how something is written, everyone reads the words as their own mind "hears" them. I thought you did just fine and nothing indicated to me that you were being critical; just your usual 'musing self! : )

To Ray I'd like to just say that it's a "fad". Just like in all the arts (clothing, home products, etc), the collectors, gallery owners and general public keep looking for "something new". I love most of the dyed, burned and/or carved work; some is over done for my taste. I like the work where you can see the grain and still know it's wood; some make me ask "why waste the wood, take a piece of pottery and paint it"!

There is a great many people who want to buy pure wood (no enhancements) and equal number of people who want "something new". I think gallerys have to keep offering new or their clientele will go somewhere else searching for the new piece.

The paint-it trend doesn't seem to affect the interest in fine pieces that are pure wood; they still make all of us go "oohh"! Check out Wally Dickerman's work for example; absolutely beautiful and not a drop of paint!

Well, back to the shop to turn some naked bowls! : )

Ruth

Woodturners Logo My shop and Turnings at

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Reply to
Ruth

Many thanks to all of you for your cordial understanding (standing?) of this COC. Humor, or what stands for it, is often a refuge for the mediocre. but of course, not me. ;) In summary then: ornamentation of turned wood is a non-issue. Bad is bad, Good is good. Arch

Fortiter,

Reply to
Arch

Right on! I totally and wholeheartedly agree!

I'm afraid that I react to turned wooden items with color added (even if we call it art) much in the same way that I react to a tattooed female breast. Others may find great beauty in both.

One of life's great (and oft ignored) truths is that God's handiwork is mighty hard to improve upon. I we still insist on trying, the effort should be undertaken very, very carefully. Perhaps even reverently.

Let's not forget that wood, with its beautiful figure, burls, etc., is God's work. Dare we even attempt to improve on that? How could we? Should we not confine our efforts to revealing the beauty that is already there? Same goes for the tattoo on the female anatomy. Shame on us!

Barry

Reply to
Barry N. Turner

Any belief is fine as long as you share it, eh?

appropriate.

Reply to
George

Barry: Let's not forget that wood, with its beautiful figure, burls, etc., is God's work. ^^^^^^^^^^^ Dan: Uh, daring to start a flaming, crusading war, let's stick to woodturning instead of religion. ^^^^^^^^^^^ Leo: I'm not religious, but when I read a statement like Barry's, I substitute "nature's" for God's," and if it still makes sense, I deal with it on that level. No need to fight a war on something we can agree on.

On the other hand, Barry, I think you are setting an arbitrary boundary between acceptable modifications of natural beauty, and what is *going too far.* I see beauty in a naturally formed piece of driftwood, or an eroded stone, so how can I give myself permission to modify a piece of wood on the lathe. And then, after I have altered its shape and texture, where do I get permission to dope it up with oils, or varnishes, or other finishes? If I stain it, to enhance the grain, is that OK? And then, if I add some color, because I think that adds to the beauty of the finished object, how is that different from the steps that preceded it?

All of these processes must be done in good taste, with artistry and restraint. But, what is accepable, what we consider beautifuy, changes with the times. Styles go in and out, and then come back. How different the Victorian styles are from the arts and crafts. Yet both are valid--both can be done well or badly, and neither can be justified by reference to any

*absolute*.
Reply to
Leo Lichtman

Nope. I'd respond with, "Off topic" if someone who shared my belief posted the same thing. And, perhaps they already have.

Reply to
Dan Bollinger

Leo.............I agree with you. I think. I wasn't trying to set new boundaries..........just tell how my personal boundaries tend to run.

No one needs my permission or anyone else's to color, stain or do whatever else they would like to a piece of wood (or to one's anatomy). Maybe I was pleading for a little restraint and good taste in both arenas.

I was only offering my opinion. You and everyone else is certainly free ........to take it or leave it. As for starting a war...........I think we already have enough conflict in the world.

Barry

Reply to
Barry N. Turner

Truer words were never spoken Arch! Excellent treatise on color theory to boot!

Dan (Eccentric by Nature)

Reply to
Dan

Thank you Dan. I guess that we have now come full circle around this color wheel, and it sure presented a variety of shades, tints and bold colors. My attitude toward the thread has also made a sort of circle. I think I can now put it safely to rest.

As the thread unravelled, at first I was chagrined, then I was confused, then embarrassed, then irked, then guilty and apprehensive. I reread the entire thread and began musing (my excuse for wool gathering) about what it says for our NG.

RCW is a healthy NG. In a small way like war, good things spin off from bad threads. Embedded in the thread were many cogent comments. They are important, but I believe that two characteristics that insure the survival of RCW were displayed: a genuine and selfless interest in _all facets of woodturning and the innate courtesy of our members. "Manners Maketh Man" sure applies to this group, and as with family squabbles our differences seem to make us stronger at the end of almost every COLORFUL thread. I'm no Pollyanna, but somehow I'm not worried about having to find a better woodturning group. Thanks for not laughing at my primer, and thanks for each of your posts. Arch

(Aside to my COC chief. You can't tear my stripes off. You weren't very crotchety either.)

Fortiter,

Reply to
Arch

Hmmm. Probably due to the two cohos (salmon) I caught. Went out the other day, wind howlin' like a banshee, rain falling horizontally. Tossed some slightly spalted herring out and just had an all around blast. Nice and snug in my raingear and just happy as a clam. Hard to stay crotchety in weather like that when the fish are biting. Did lose on.

Oh, and just to keep things on topic, I carefully watched the waves in case a wayward cocobolo log happened to float up from Souch America. One didn't, but I was looking.

Fishing & turning in God's country...

...Kevin

Reply to
Kevin & Theresa Miller

Kevin, not understanding the situation, wrote, "...in case a wayward cocobolo log happened to float up....."

********************************************** Chief, you were on topic, but naive in your hopes. Those guys on the coasts of Caleefornia, Washington and B.C. would never let a log of any species float by.:( A. ****************************************

Fortiter,

Reply to
Arch

Chuck wrote: (clip) Does cocobolo even float? (clip) ^^^^^^^^^^^^ Seems like a good question for David Letterman.

Reply to
Leo Lichtman

LOL! I'm surprised someone didn't Google this question instead of guess. Ain't this the information age!? Cocobolo is the second most dense hardwood in the world. Anything denser that water (specific gravity of 1.00 by definition) will not float:

Lignum Vitae 1.05 Cocobolo 1.10 Ironwood 1.30

Reply to
Dan Bollinger

Dan:

Your research is a pretty good demonstration of why one must take with a grain of salt just about any 'facts' from the internet.

The numbers for Lignum and Cocobolo are from samples. There can be significant differences in the real world.

There is no such thing as ironwood -- not really. Every part of the world has something which they call ironwood and they are all different species. So, for ironwood to have any meaning at all, you need to know who is calling the wood that and where they are. Then you might be able to make a good guess.

Use of non-scientific names for species is a real problem. In Guatemala the locals use the name Granadillo for the wood we call cocobolo. In parts of Africa Granadillo is what we call African Blackwood (a Dalbergia -- a rosewood, as is Cocobolo).

That said, most of the cocobolo I've ever tested, when dry, still will not float.

There are thousands of known species and probably plenty that we don't know. To say something is the most dense or the second most dense is just asking for trouble.

BTW, do a little research on Snakewood -- the one from Guiana and Surinam. The references indicate that it is less dense than lignum and cocobolo but every sample I've ever messed with measured in the 1.4 range green. And, there isn't much moisture in them so dry they shouldn't be much less.

Bill

Reply to
Bill Rubenstein

Bill, Yep, anyone can say anything on a website. The claim that cocobolo was the second most dense came from the cocobolo.net website. I figure they ought to know. They could have said second most dense known wood and been more accurate. I couldn't find my copy of the Wood Properties Handbook to do a better check and I couldn't find anything at FPL, which is strange.

Reply to
Dan Bollinger

Dan, what is the cocobolo. net website?

TGIA,

Jay Sweeney in NH

Reply to
S S Law NH

Check it out.

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Reply to
Dan Bollinger

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