OT proposed discussion: How did you learn to be a "woman" rather than a "girl"?

My hair gets a cut every 5 weeks and that's almost too long to go between cuts. If I go any longer than that, I get really shaggy. Of course, when you where your hair short like I do, the shaggies probably show up faster than when you wear it longer.

Wow, what a variety of responses here!!!

First, Tricia I hope you can see this is a thread that shows you are not alone! I for one (even though I don't post often) am glad you felt comfortabel enough to ask these questions, even if you were squirming while you typed them out, then wondered out loud if you should hit the send button ;))

I was never taught about makeup. I was quite the tomboy growing up - that hasn't changed! Don't own a dress or skirt. Makeup - I work as a courtroom clerk in our county's superior court - consists of lightly applied eyeliner in dark brown, lightly applied auburn pencil to my reddish/blondish eyebrows, neutral eyeshadow - just a touch, one coat of dark brown mascara, tinted lip moisturizer. I drink lots of water and keep a moisturizer on my face in the winter. That's it.

Hair - mine is very thick, naturally wavy/curly. Six weeks ago I went from half-way down my back to just below the ears, layered. Never have done perms/color/rollers/blowdry. Wash and dry naturally. I simply refuse to do more!

Clothes - I am not fazed by current fashion. Working in the conservative environment I do, daily "uniform" is dark slacks, blazer type jacket and knit shirt underneath. I don't follow the "dress to the nines" idea, going for professional-looking comfort instead. I do make sure I have a long sleeve jacket on at all times the court session is going, or the public is in the courtroom. Hardly anyone knows about my tattoos that are visible once the jacket comes off ;))

As has been mentioned, how you feel about yourself comes acrost stronger than you'll ever realize. Believe in yourself. Smile inwardly and outwardly. Know you can do the job you are going for, and convince the prospective employer. Confidence not agressiveness seems to work.

Bless you for having the courage to post your note to us! That's confidence that you can build on ;))

G> No offense to our male readers/quilters, but this topic is weighing on

Howdy!

Probably for the same reason someone would mention her babies staying in the hospital for a while after birth, or the Clogs she wears to ease the pain in her hip, or any number of other subjects marked Off Topic: because there's a large crowd of people here who care about each other. ;-) ..and we like to talk.

(((Irene)))

Ragmop/Sandy -- we often like to talk about quilts! ;-D

Howdy!

Catherines has good clothing and great sales:

Meeting people: Tricia! Keep trying. Getting to know folks at church? Join the volunteers! When there's a meeting (committee, women's group, groundskeepers, etc.) show up. If you're easy for people to overlook, they will. You CAN do this. (Believe me, "they" don't fire volunteers. )

Ragm>

Joan you have almost wrote my story too. My Mom never wore makeup so I wasn't allowed to wear it. Well, when I turned 16 I was allowed to wear a very pale eye shadow and mascara but the mascara made my My Grandmother pierced my ears for my 16th birthday and I had to beg my parents to let me have that done. I am a cosmetologist and I still don't like wearing makeup. Granted a lot of my problem with it is sensitive skin. Most makeup foundations burn my skin so it's just not worth the bother. But I totally understand about the feelings of disconnect. I often feel the same way. So I just tell myself that if people don't like my looks then they don't have to look at me.

Hugs, Mika

When I'm in need of changing hair stylists & don't have any current recommendations, I call a salon & tell the receptionist that I'm looking for a new hairdresser & I have lots of hair, but no ability to style it. Can I meet with one of their stylists to discuss my hair & see if we would be a good fit? It's usually not a problem - just have to schedule a time when they aren't busy. I've never been charged for it, but I suppose it wouldn't be out of order to do so. Be sure & tell them you need remedial hair styling help:)

Good you're going to the doctor. I didn't think you had a pizza face. I know what you mean though - I had more break outs when I was in my 30's &

40's than I did as a teenager.

I used to suffer terribly from PMS - my evil twin came out then. That's something you may want to discuss with your MD as well - there is help out there for you. Keep your chin up & keep asking for help. You'll start to make changes & they'll start to be easier & pretty soon, things will fall into place for you.

You can also "interview" potential hairstylists to see if you

I agree with Sandy about volunteering. I have many, many good friends that I would have never met if I hadn't volunteered to coordinate a Project Linus chapter.

Organizations are always looking for volunteers. I'm convinced that our volunteers (me included) get as much out of making Project Linus blankets as the kids do out of receiving the blankets.

Tricia, You mentioned nails & not wearing polish. I don't know what is "trendy" in your area, but I live in the San Francisco Bay Area & most "professional" women that I encounter have nicely groomed nails, with clear or almost clear nail polish. You said you usually make a mess with nail polish, but if you tried a clear polish, it wouldn't matter if you made a mess, because it wouldn't show, but your nails would look nicely groomed. Just another thought . . .

another long useless rambling of pointlessness, lol. ....... this just goes to show how easily it is to misread the meaning of a post. i'm sure we all do it now and again. i'm sure we all forget when posting to be sure what we say wont be taken too much differently than what we mean. i knew what you meant, Irene. but then again, maybe i was just in the right frame of mind when you wrote it. i also understood what tricia meant when asking about it all in the first place. so for the record.... tho i wore make-up in my late teens/twentys. after having a couple of kids who has time and by the time they were no longer babys i didnt really care if i needed make-up anymore. now its just too much trouble. i use lots of moisturizer, sometimes i even remember to use a toner first, then chapstick if the old lips feel a bit dry. thats about it for me. i cut my own hair, last time i took off about 15 inches in mid May. it started out blonde but now is more a dull light sumpin, going white, not grey. i'd love to lighten it again but its just too much trouble i think. i've never coloured my hair so not too sure what or where to start, lol. oh wait, i did use lemon juice yrs ago when i spent hrs sunbathing. dont bother doing that now either, no good for the skin now and when its hot enough all i want to do is take a nap, lol. getting old aint a a thimbleful of fun. i had a thot on make up just now....there is powder stuff you brush on that has spheres of light that are supposed to even out your skin tone and can also be used as a blusher and eyeshadow, no idea how it works but for one price might be worth a look/see around the pharmacy/drug store for something similar. i'm sure they have one much the same there in usa. it comes in choice for light or dark skinned ladies. can be brushed where ever you need to give you a slightly tanned appearance. heres a couple of links of the brands here in nz.

are a few different brands of the same type stuff.those will give you a better idea of what i'm rambling on about. :)cheers, jeanne

Its not just the big volunteering opportunities. I seem to be the expert in our Church Hall/Community Hall kitchen! Helping with the coffee at meetings is a brilliant way to meet people, and they always find getting people to volunteer difficult.

You just say 'Do you need any help' and you don't have to ask twice, and chatting over the washingup afterwards is great for breaking the ice. Sounds mundane, but it works, and every group you join drink coffee!.

Last week I spent a day serving tea and light refreshments to the troups (our town carnival had the band of the Welsh Guards), and on Saturday it was an animal charity's sale, and guess who was serving tea/coffee. I'm also one of the few people who is confident empying the hot water urn!

You will soon get a reputation for being williang and reliable. DH and I volunteered to be responsible for putting the chairs out at our local Civic Society meetings, an easy job but really appreciated, and I give lifts to non-driving neighbours when we are going to the same meetings. Giving lifts also means you have someone to sit with!

Another little thought on getting to know people. Guilds/Women's groups etc often have little sub groups of about 10 people. Our Women's Institute has an informal slimming club (bit of a joke really, the weighing is quick and the chat is long!) and a Lunch group (a lot of the same people as the slimming group(!). You soon get to know just

10 people, and they get to know you even quicker as they only have to learn one new name. Then you will find that you are greeted by name at the bigger meetings and will be introduced to the 10 people's friends.!

Four years ago DH and I knew nobody. Now, between us, we know lots of people.

-- Sally at the Seaside ~~~~~~~~~~ (uk)

I agree with Sandy about volunteering. I have many, many good friends that

That is a difficult one. I never get my make up done at the "counter" for this exact reason. I would suggest you get a professional make up artist to do it, like the type who work at a beauty salon. But if you are in a small town this might be difficult.

Once I went to buy a product and was chatting with the sales lady. We were interupted by this gorgeous, gorgeous woman of a certain age. Her skin was flawless, she glowed. She bought her product and left. I asked the sales woman if this women used their products, she told me what she used & I BOUGHT ALL OF IT!!!

So, I don't go to the counters anymore!!!

"Tricia" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:

"Tricia" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com:

I really think that if you do care it will show. Just be neat and tidy (boring I keep repeating this!) and it will show. Everyone gets break outs and people understand that, especailly if your hair is clean & not fly away, ie. well brushed, your clothes are neat & ironed and well fitting, your shoes are polished, your hands are clean. Voila!

I really think the problem is more about how YOU feel. All of this "stuff" will help you look better & feel better. And you will be more confident.

Go again! It always take a few times before we feel comfortable. And once people see you again they will start to talk to you. I don't know why it is but people often igore the new person. Once you are not the new person, you'll be fine.

I would also suggest you look for a tennis group, volleyball, group of walkers, hikers, or even a group of people who do dog training (if you have a dog of course!). Not the really serious players, but just fun people who like to be outdoors. This will get you moving and meeting people.

I would also suggest ball room dancing but I know it's sometimes next to impossible to get the DH's to do this!!

"Tricia" wrote in news:1156814210.308988.191760 @75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:

I think the really yuky part of make up is the foudation. That's feels ugh. I only wear that at night, but a bit of eye shadow & eyeliner & lipstick is what I feel comfortable with.

"Tricia" wrote in news:1156815359.249199.43210 @m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com:

LOL, That was really funny!!! ;o)

"Tricia" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com:

quilting.

There is always a group of teenage girls who will spackle themselves. That's why it's best to take those girls to get lessons rather than leave them to put everything on thier faces. Most girls are picking this stuff up from TV & magazines and not from actual people.

I grew up in the 80's. We had eye make from eye to hairline! I can swear I never met and adult who wore that! (nope, never actully met BoyGeorge!) Sad really when we were getting makeup tips from the MEN!! ;o)

Yes, it was the 80s that taught me "less is more" & stick to neutral colors!

I had a feeling this was more what was going on than your make up!! There is always something behind it.

I'm in the exact same boat as you. I moved away, gained weight & still can't find a "real" job! All I can say is it takes time and it's difficult. Now you know, so don't worry anymore! Just take it a step at a time. Taking care of my self makes me feel better so the hard part is easier. This is because I feel better, not what others think of me. I have put my best foot forward. This doesn't mean I'm spackled!!

solution.

Yeah!! Good for you!

I wouldn't bother with foundation. Really. That's the one thing that will look really bad if done wrong. I rearly use it. And it's probably not good for the ance. You really need to see a doctor. They can help you with this. My DH had a skin problem.He was convinced nothing could be done. I insisted that he see a doctor. They gave him a treatment & the problem is gone. He was very sad that he spent years with this problem when it was so easy to fix.

"Tricia" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:

I agree with others who have said to buy new stuff. I also have hazel eyes. I use champagne color eyeshadow. Just a little bit in the outside half, bottom half of the lid. I but a dab with the brush it comes with. I don't even move the brush. Just dab that size. Then I blend it with my fingers. Then I but the eyeliner also from the middle of the eye to outside corner. Make a thin line. Then smudge a tiny bit. Practice. You don't have to leave the house! Just see what it feels like. If you don't like it take it off.

I would suggest you also change your make up but if you want to practice with the old stuff then take off the first layer and sharpen the pencil a few times.

If you have light eyebrows it will be nice to fill them in just a little bit. They will stand out more. Use a color just a tiny bit darker than your eyebrow color. I have black eyebrows & never thought I needed eyebrow pencil, but I was shocked to see how much better they look. So, I'm sure light eyebrows will be enhanced.

I rarely use polish now. I used to do my nails all the time, now I just keep them short, shaped & clean. But, if you have a nail salon near you that isnt' too expensive, you should try it! It's fun. (We used to have one that was $10 for a manicure! I luxury I don't get anymore! No more $10 manicures.

Good! Now the fit is really important. Buy the right size & get it tailored it if doesn't fit right. I had a hard time admitting I was a bigger size, but when I got clothes to fit properly I felt much better in them, even with the extra weight. I didn't fell squeezed into them.

Keep 'em clean! Even your tennis shoes (as much as you can)! Good! I think you are doing much better than you suggested! ;o)

"Tricia" wrote in news:1156817078.237341.117300 @75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:

Ok. never mind! but it is surprising to be able to return make up. Usually that is a no no. In case you are curious....

BE CAFEFUL!! You might get lost in there! ;o) There is a tips & tricks section, with video, but remember they are using WAY more make up than you or I should even consider!!

"Tricia" wrote in news:1156817743.491739.319130 @i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

YES! You can send them privately if you want.

Yes, that is another point: Tricia, if you put it on, you have to take it all off!! That's very important!! ;o)

"Dawn in Alberta" wrote in news:hkLIg.480280$iF6.308259@pd7tw2no: