Happy Channukah

Let's please not discuss lemon chicken.

The neighbor has a lemon tree that extends into my yard, so I thought I'd make lemon chicken. I'm still trying to get the burned-on lemon sauce off the Corning Ware I cooked it in.

In our family, leftover mashed potatoes are chilled in a loaf pan, sliced, and fried till crispy brown.

I couldn't get them to come out right, till I asked my grandmother for the secret. Silly me, I thought any "grease" would work, and I was frying them in butter. The secret turned out to be solid Crisco. Don't ask me WHY that works and butter doesn't, margarine doesn't, liquid oil doesn't, but it's got to be solid Crisco.

And it has to be real potatoes, not instant. Don't ask how I know.

*sigh* I'm still hung up on the baking soda in the latkes - why would you put baking soda in latkes? Just really curious.

Pat in Illinois

So sorry to hear about this. Sometimes it just happens.

LOL - not quite a disaster but it felt like it. I made some seemingly great recipe for a lamb in pomegramate & wine sauce with raisins. Very rich - for a holiday dinner - got the recipe from a Joan Nathan cookbook. Unfortunately I hadn't tried it first and screwed up something so I slightly scorched what was in the bottom - but not enough to really ruin anything. Then, I think the guests were all late, and well - it turned out to so cooked down, and much less than expected - it tasted okay but looked horrid. Really horrid - dark, and just well, dark. Fortunately everything else was good - and everyone ate lots of soup. Then we all laughed about the time I made this vegetable/sweet potato kugel. And when I went for the paprika but put cajun seasoning instead! It was actually good - but definitely spicy.

ellice

And that is where you were raised???? Or you just got his tales of what those households were like.

So that said, all the gentile guys I dated for a couple of months here and there, or longer, have now made me an expert so that I should tell my gentile friends what their traditions are?

Interesting. There aren't that many cantors around. Just curious - have you been to holiday dinners with the cantor and family?

Who undoubtedly discussed their traditions at great length with you. I guess since they must've been sharing their personal family traditions with you these wouldn't be the same horrible lawyers you worked for that insist you wear high heels to work, or didn't believe in your illnesses, and were so generally awful in not accepting your disabilities, making you come to work regardless, and so forth.

Y'know - if you said that you spoke with a bunch of your female friends who cook for their families and they told you that they just fry up anything for Chanukah - or that you discussed it with them - you'd have some credibility. And not sound so "I must be the authority" . It's a little ludicrous - but I guess since your father turned the lights on and off in a neighborhood of Shabbat observant Jews, that would convey upon you the right to tell people that actually observe a tradition that's not yours what is "right" .

And so ...having a bunch of Southwest Cookbooks - that actually come off the bookshelf and are used - would have me telling my Mexican American friends how they should celebrate a holiday - foodwise? Glad you have a Hadassah cookbook.

The point is Karen, that on the essential thing about using oil for Chanukah food we agreed. Just not for "anything" . But, hey - if you want to celebrate Chanukah and have your own version of traditional - good for you. And your making a pronouncement of what is right seems just a bit out of place - as opposed to just saying that you've been told anything will do. Fine for that person - but to be colloquial - where do you get off telling someone of a different faith/culture what is the "right" thing for their observance?

What you may or may not look up on the net isn't the be-all, end-all of real life applications of traditions.

ellice

Well, you could have done that - if you knew enough to know that once potatoes are cut open, grated, etc you keep them in a water bath to prevent them from turning (oxidizing).

ellice

If I can figure out the shipping thing - I'm taking orders ;^) The wierdest potato pancake story I had was from grad school. My German officemate - from Aachen - decided to make them for our "international" dinner (bunch of grad students from the same group). Anyhow - he came over to my apt to do this - and I can still see his big hairy hands sticking into the pot - made them in my biggest stockpot - maybe 12 qts. I was scared that they were full of knuckle hair! But my dad used to say they weren't genuine unless someone got some blood in the mix from the grater.

ellice

Interesting. I do the grated thing - but I also puree some of them - the consistency holds really well that way. Never, ever, ever, use the mix. I do at times buy some frozen "Ratners" mini-potato pancakes. One of the goddaughters made homemade applesauce today - so tomorrow we're getting together in the evening for our Chanukah exchange, and latkes with homemade applesauce - her mom says it's fab. Evidently it was so good when she made it on Saturday that they went out, bought more apples, adding some varieties and made this even better batch!

ellice

Well, I'm sure it tasted good, but don't know about the traditional tie-in. There are some people who think the fried item should be a kind of thing that you could envision as being eaten with your hands - sort of the battlefield hurried what food do we have thing. We were talking about this

- if just having some oil in a pan versus something truly fried or close to deep fried is really the thing. The standard traditional things are fried in a lot of oil. But, whatever works. We had hot dogs and spinach latkes today! It was a weird meal, but there was a reason, so....

ellice

Anne Hahahahha Grating by blender or food processor is not cheating hahahhah it is making life easier ,,,, and it does not affect the taste , nore the meaning of the latkes ,,,,,, Which are after all only a Tradition,

not a Law ,,, mirjam

If you'd participated in observing the traditional Chanukah meals, then you'd know that not everything is fried. Meals are usually including things which complement the fried or remembrance food. As in brisket with latkes. Else - we could all go to MacDonalds and have the full fried meal for Chanukah. Except for those years of the little problem of their use of lard.

What do you mean by recent - you said you've had this cookbook for "+ 25 years"? Hmmm, I guess you just ignored that part about the jelly doughnuts in my earlier post. And FWUW - one cookbook doesn't make you an expert - in any type of cuisine - IMHO.

One would think then you'd have known to have paper plates, cups, etc so that you could provide her water, or any drink from a container that was pareve. I guess you missed that lesson. And if you'd understood the kashreit rules, you'd also understand that frying anything wouldn't be appropriate - to pick the nit - as there are many foods which do not meet dietary restrictions. More interesting - that if you were so serious as to be about to marry a Jewish man that kept Kosher one would thing you'd have been converting as well - as it's very hard to imagine someone that observant marrying out of the faith.

Maybe your cantor friend assumes that you know that anything isn't ANYTHING. No one is assuming you know nothing - rather that you don't know everything and are speaking from outside looking in as to how a tradition is observed in actual practice - not from what a book said.

ellice

Some people add a little bit of leavening to the mix. Not much. My SIL's mother would add seltzer or club soda. Matzoh meal which is the binder that most people use (not bread crumbs) doesn't have anything to help them rise. So, when you mix the potatoes, and matzoh meal, egg, spices, onion - depending on the quantity - people add a little baking soda or baking powder. Like 1/2 -1 teaspoon depending on how big the batch. Not much at all. Or a splash of the soda/seltzer. The seem to be a little "brighter" in taste - not fluffy - but they're not so flat, heavy after frying. Anyhow

- most everyone I know puts a little bit in their latkes.

IME - as with anything you make with fruits or veggies - a lot depends on the water content of the main component - what type it is, salt, water, etc when you mix it all up it just needs the right consistency.

ellice

Hmmm, how about bacon grease? Works well for sliced, leftover boiled potatoes.

Karen i don`t care if your source is a cantor , or what ever profession he has. I am sure he has a wonderful Voice and sings his prayers beautifully , but does he cook? stay in the kitchen and remember what his mother used to do This time of year?.

Some traditions evolve over generations and become an essential part of a ceremony or a holiday. That is why they are called tradition.... i assure you that Mary And Joseph , Didn`t have a Fir Tree , [which doesn`t grow here at all] Nore electric lights , nore little figures of angels, nore packed presents for the children, etc,,, stillyou consider it an essential part of the Christmas Tradional party.

And last but not least, there are many traditions unknown to you that Jewish people in different Diasporas adopted, and they are acceptable.

And in Israel people learn from each other some are accepted by others and some are not so popular,,,

Usually people learn many years to understand `traditions` , how and why they evolved. How they are related to one`s own life, etc.... The Hebrew word for tradition is Masoret = ' That which is being handed over ` / `That which is being delivered` .

I must say your `sources` are always very interesting, but seem not so well informed. As an educated woman , why don`t you speak about the things YOU personally are well read about. mirjam

Not necessarily a disaster but something that didn't turn out as expected and wanting opinions:

DH makes applesauce every fall since we have a really good local orchard to support. This year he overdid things and we have more than we know what to do with so he tried a recipe for applesauce bread in the machine. The bread didn't raise quite as much as expected and the crust didn't brown at all. The cookbook is designed for bread machines, so that shouldn't be the problem. He's really good about making certain the ingredients are room temp before using. My guess is the recipe assumed store-bought, sugar-laden applesauce and the homemade is a bit on the tart side. The recipe only called for a very small amount of brown sugar and no white sugar at all. Would adding more sugar to the applesauce before adding to the machine make much difference--feed the yeast and help the crust brown? The flavor of the bread was also a little bland but perfect if topped with apple butter.

Taking a guess here... But I wonder if the more tart applesauce is a little "off" on the pH requirements for the yeast? Not enough to kill them, but enough to slow them down so the bread doesn't rise as quickly.

I have no experience with bread makers, but I do make quite a bit of homemade bread by hand. And whenever I proof my yeast I always add honey to the warm water. 1-2 tsp of honey - I never measure it exactly. The yeast get all bubbly, and the bread rises fine. I wonder if proofing the yeast first would help your applesauce bread?

All in all, if you think the sugar won't make the bread too sweet, I don't think it could hurt the yeast. I'd give it a try... I'd also expect that adding white sugar would help since I *think* it's a simpler sugar than brown sugar, which means the yeast should use it more quickly.

That's my two cents (after studying chemistry way too late tonite...)

--Mickey Edmonton, AB

to reply: mickey18385 at yahoo dot com

You're right. He knows that I certainly would never serve him fried pork rinds.

You're the one who threw that notion out there by assuming that I thought "anything" meant ANYTHING.

Good question. I never have enough bacon grease around at any one time to cook with.

Hard fried egg in a sandwich? Live dangerously! Half the enjoyment of eating a fried egg sandwich is dealing with the runny yolk