Interesting... Maybe things differ more than we realize between the U.S. and Canada. I will also add that we are more familiar with the Science faculties, rather than the Arts. At the risk of being flamed, his experience taking university business courses has been quite interesting. He got an A+ in a 4th year business course, and yet is a Science major. The Professor was not at all happy when DS and his friend pointed out errors in the Math part of what the Professor was teaching. Kinda of scary...
I have no idea what the difference in salary for the new person is, if there is any. I would think my friend's DH would be making more based on years of service and experience. My friend's husband is very sought after because of his area of expertise, there are very few who have the education, and experience to take his place. He is currently training his replacement, but it took a lot of looking to find someone suitable.
He already has a mentor, and also a Professor he keeps in touch with from his college days.
Last we discussed it he wants to complete his Masters this year, take some time and work in private business, then make a decision as to whether or not he will do his PhD. He has experienced life in academia, so now he wants to try the business world. He is only 24 yrs. old, so has a lot of time to make these decisions. He's been going to school since he was 4 yrs. old, so I think he feels he needs a break. As I mentioned he has done his entire post-secondary education on scholarships and grants, so he's in a very enviable position as compared to many students graduating these days.
...Linda (who is thinking DS may have changed his mind too...one never knows)
Umm - Dawne, I don't know which University you worked at, but my sister is at McMaster. She has her Masters, but not her PhD. And I do know that her salary is much higher than that. Now part of that is because she has a joint academic/administrative position, but not all.
She was laughing a year or two ago that her name was going to appear on the list that Ontario puts out every year for those people employed in government funded institutions who make more than $100,000. She hasn't reached there yet, but will probably do so before she retires.
I work at a commuity college in a support position, and I'm pushing $50,000 (partially because of seniority)
So it may vary from province to province, university to university.
Elizabeth, could you explain the term "salary compression"? I've seen it in a few posts, but don't understand quite what it means from the context. Thank you.
--Mickey Mansfield, MA
(whose DH has started the search for a tenure-track position at a research university)
In means that raises don't keep up with inflation or the cost of living so people don't move forward very quickly once they've been hired. Starting salaries have to be fairly competitive, though, so salary compression is the term used to describe the situation where new hires are making almost as much (or in some cases more) than people with significant seniority. In Massachusetts, it means that it's very important to negotiate well for your starting salary, because you'll never really get another chance to jump significantly.
Business school is a different sort of beast. The academic content is not rocket science (for most, anyway). What gets people is usually the other stuff. A good B. school will usually really put you through your paces in terms of your ability to integrate material, read and synthesize and prepare boatloads of material, argue and present your ideas, manage your time, and interact/coordinate with other people. Which, when you think of it, is pretty consistent with what is asked of managers. There is, of course, content to deal with as well in the various areas. It's not like there's nothing to learn. But in general, those who come to B. school with science backgrounds tend to find the accounting/finance/economics/statistics/IS/ operations classes relatively easy (while many of the more liberal arts folks will find them harder), but they often struggle in the HR/OB/IB/marketing/etc. kinds of classes. And if they're in the program, rather than just taking a course here or there, they really tend to struggle with the level of group work and projects and reading/writing/case prep/etc. Every area has things which are challenging and things which are easier, depending on your personal skills and temperament. MBA programs draw from a wide variety of backgrounds, so it's always interesting to see which folks struggle with what.
What can be tricky with this is being objective enough to make sure one's mentor is really able to get the job done with a PhD student. There are lots of very good, very interesting faculty who just don't function very well as a committee chair or as help for getting a job (even if their intentions are good). Getting a PhD is, in many ways, more about the process than it is about achieving a particular level of academic expertise. Many people have great research ideas, and even do great research, but still fail at the process of getting through the PhD process. There are doctoral programs that only successfully graduate fewer than half their candidates, and even within reasonable programs, some faculty will have much higher success rates at getting students through than others. There's a lot of politics involved, so you have to know how your chair fits into the department and what sort of "pull" he or she has. It's always risky going with an untenured faculty member as a chair (though sometimes there are compelling reasons to do so...but you'd better get done before their tenure review in case they don't make it). There are just a lot of these little crappy things that can make or break the process, and it's wise to take a step back and think really critically about them before committing to a program. People tend to think that doctoral programs are about reaching a higher plane of academic expertise, and that's partly true, but part of it is a real sort of initiation rite as well ;-) And it can really suck to get into the middle of a PhD program and suddenly realize that academia isn't really all what you thought it was! But at least with your son, he's in a field where the PhD can be useful outside of academia as well.
That's a great thing to do. It's good to have a taste of industry to figure out what sort of career path he'd most enjoy there (and whether a PhD would be useful for that), and real life experience also really informs the PhD process as well.
Even if he doesn't need it, it's often good to take it at this point. Lots of graduate programs these days are even requiring it. When I applied for my masters, they accepted me into the program, but for a year later because they wanted me to get some real world experience first.
...or that in order to get ahead salary-wise, you'll have to change companies. DH has made all his significant gains by changing companies, and it used to be practically a joke at a previous company we worked at. Folks would leave to go to another job at a significantly higher salary, and everyone would say, "See you in a few years!" and "Everyone comes home to Mother " Sure enough, most would come back, often having doubled their salary with the two job-hops (away and then back again). Of course, the job market has to be good to be able to do that ;-)
My DS has recently taken an administrative position at a Canadian university which pays about as well as his private industry job did--he has an MSc in Computer Engineering. A comparable teaching position wouldn't, even if he were to complete his PhD. So that is another option to consider--- Dawne
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