Firehouse Angel Update

It wouldn't be a mess if Caryn hadn't interjected herself into the conversation with nothing positive to say. Or had Victoria stayed out since she had already made it clear that she wanted nothing whatsoever to do with the project - and she had made that decision months ago with great fanfare.

Of course I'm pleased that she started the idea. I give her credit for that and wish she had continued. Nobody "took over". Each had their duties to perform. Her anger multiplied when the project didn't get done as soon as she thought it should. She was given the angel to stitch on and sat on it for several months without doing a thing. It then went on to someone else who volunteered.

Tia Mary kept track of the stitchers and where things were in the process. Bless her for taking on responsibilities that no one else volunteered to do. Responsibilities that were needed to see to the project's conclusion. Victoria could have picked up that slack but didn't. I kept up the website but certainly never tried to take control. I voiced my opinion when questions and decisions were being made. But it was just one opinion of many, in a democratic process where we all got together and came up with solutions everyone could live with.

As someone mentioned to me, sometimes not doing something immediately is just as meaningful. It means you aren't forgotten, even though time has passed.

This was a group project done with a great deal of enthusiasm and love. Victoria asked if anyone was interested. The response was gratifying to say the least. If you haven't followed the entire process, then you can't realize that.

I'm just so very sorry that two people are making it difficult for the rest of us to enjoy the project more fully. It amazes me that in spite of it all, those involved are still forging ahead and trying hard to ignore the interference.

Dianne

Reply to
Dianne Lewandowski
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AMEN!

Carolyn

Reply to
Twinsmom

Jangchub, you're making Buddhism look bad. Remember:

"May all beings be happy and have the causes of happiness. May all beings be free from sorrow, and the causes of sorrow.. May they have that great happiness that is without sorrow. May they come to rest in the great equanimity free from attachment and aversion."

Jangchub, your attachments and aversions are showing...

Karma Drolma Zangmo

Reply to
brisingamen

No one "took control" of this project. If you think I am the one who did this, please have take some pride in yourself and your opinions and muster up the courage and the gumption to say so. Victoria chose not to be responsible for the "day to day" chores that are necessary on this type of project. She gladly and willingly handed that job over to me and was relieved not to have to be responsible. There is no issue of betrayed "trust" here. Victoria IS the mother of this project and there isn't one of us who stitched on the piece who would try to take that from her. But remember, SHE chose to disassociate herself from the project when things didn't go exactly as she wanted. Victoria is the one who wanted this to be a group project and her first mistake was repeatedly telling everyone that time was not a critical issue. If she had a date in mind for when she wanted the project finished, she should have been up front with all of us about that from the very start! When the project took longer than she wanted she became upset and demanded that everything be sent back to her so that SHE could finish the Angel and then do with it as she pleased. By that time the majority of the volunteers had stitched on the piece and those still in the rotation felt that they should be allowed to have their turn. I whole heartedly agreed with this and said the same in posts to the group. Also remember that when Victoria had the piece in her possession so that she could stitch on it, she said she was unable to do so because she was too ill and she sent the piece on to someone else. With her recurring illnesses, does anyone think she would have completed the project any sooner? I suppose you think that Dianne and I are the ones who "tore" the project out of Victoria's hands. Well forget about Dianne -- all she is guilty of is generously hosting & maintaining the website and being honest with the group about her feelings. I guess this means I am to blame yet again. VBS -- if there was anything to actually be blamed for, then I would gladly take the blame. But I'm afraid that you are imagining things that did not happen. Victoria's idea for this project was a wonderful one and I am sure we are all thankful that she took the initiative to get the ball rolling. Unfortunately for her, she didn't think the whole thing through and was much too optimistic in her plans for the project. If she had told us at the beginning that she her plan was to have the piece finished within a year, things would have ended up much differently. This is what happens when a person with an idea does not communicate openly with those involved in bringing that idea to fruition. Bottom line -- Vic IS the mother of the FireHouse Angel, the Angel was never torn from her hands and she really does have only herself to blame for the project not going the way she had intended!

Reply to
Tia Mary

I wasn't sick at all. I didn't have time to stitch because I was doing full time volunteer work for my Lama.

Reply to
Jangchub

My mistake -- I realized I have made an erroneous statement when I just read the post. Perhaps your Lama would enjoy reading ALL of the posts generated on this topic? But then, I am sure he has more important things to do with his time.

Reply to
Tia Mary

Which is a perfectly valid choice, but it makes me wonder why you then felt the need to go on and on about how long the project took. You are one of the reasons it wasn't finished more quickly.

Elizabeth

Reply to
Dr. Brat

My Lama is a woman. But, this is not the church so take your controlling shit with how my Lama sees me and tell it to someone who buys into your idiocy.

Reply to
Jangchub

I had it for 8 weeks. It then disappeared last May and surfaced again recently.

Reply to
Jangchub

I beg to differ. You need to look up the history pages. Unfortunately, there are some dates missing, but she has been steadily worked on as people could get to her. She didn't disappear for 10 months.

Dianne

Reply to
Dianne Lewandowski

Correct me if I'm wrong, Vic, but early on during the planning stages, wasn't it your intent for the group to get the Angel done in a years time so that it could be presented to the FDNY on the 9/11 anniversary? I seem to have this memory in my head of the anniversary drawing near and the angel wasn't close to finished. You were a bit upset...but eventually conceded defeat and pretty much just said, "Finish it and get it there whenever." I tried to google this topic, but it didn't take long before I remembered that you x no-archive your posts, so it'd be nearly impossible to find.... I'm just wondering and figured I'd go directly to the source instead of arguing and bickering with the others. Oh...and in a couple weeks, I have plans to take my two sons (16 and 12) to:

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I want my children to experience a little of every religion that I can introduce them to before they make a decision on one. And well, I want to go see the temple too! ;-) Jenn

Reply to
Jenn Vanderslice

It didn't disappear. It was being worked on by Meredith and Linda and Cheryl and Carolyn and me. Just because you didn't bother to follow her, that doesn't mean she disappeared.

Elizabeth

Reply to
Dr. Brat

A lot of Victoria's posts when she posted as escapee are available. Also her posts are available as quotes in other works. I think if you google, you'll see that she got agitated every year around Sept 11, but other than that insisted that she was in no hurry.

She also just castigated Tia Mary for not remembering that the Angel should go to One Police Plaza, but that was never the intent. At one point Vic said that if everyone didn't get to participate we would start another RR for One Police Plaza.

I think if you look, you'll see that Vic's not remembering things very clearly. I'm assuming it's whatever treatments she's currently undergoing.

Elizabeth

Reply to
Dr. Brat

This is what I remember too. I think Vic got really upset when the piece wasn't anywhere near being finished for the anniversary last year. This is the problem with not having a definite and well publicized completion date from the beginning. If we had started off that way, we wouldn't be having all of these "problems". CiaoMeow >^;;^<

Reply to
Tia Mary

I was thinking the same thing myself. The stuff that Vic seems to be remembering is so totally different from what the rest of us remember that I was wondering if she was maybe on some strange sort of meds. It's like she has done a 180 and is off in an alternate earth dimension or something! CiaoMeow >^;;^<

Reply to
Tia Mary

Reply to
Pat P

Ah but Pat, none of the volunteer stitchers started the unkindness. If Vic is ill and under stress, she shouldn't be making herself more stressed by posting about the Angel, especially after she vociferously lobbied to have herself removed from the project. If she wanted the supplies returned to her, she could have e-mailed me about it. Let's also remember that any of us could be telling lies about our physical condition. I've never met Victoria so I have no idea if she is telling the truth about her health. We all trust that others don't lie about these things but we really have no way to know anything for sure unless we met the person. Besides, no one seems to be worrying about any stress this might be causing me. For all anyone here knows, I could be suffering from some terminal disease myself and choose not to talk about it! I'll tell you what the hospice counselor told me when my Mom was dying of cancer. Just because a person is extremely ill or dying, it does NOT give them the right to be mean to others. It is my opinion that Victoria is mean in her posts when she disagree with others. It is also my opinion and a fact that she really has done a 180 turnabout in the stuff she "remembers" and I'm not going to keep quiet about it. If voicing my opinion (especially when it's the truth) is unkind then so be it. I certainly don't see it that way especially since Victoria has been anything but kind to me!! CiaoMeow >^;;^<

Reply to
Tia Mary

How is it unkind to attempt to understand the behavior of someone who is being ravingly mean to other people? Is it less kind to say "this is an exception; there must be something wrong" than to say "oh, there she goes again?"

Elizabeth

Reply to
Dr. Brat

I knew it was asking a lot to finish that year, but I said no hurry we can get it to them next year. It doesn't matter. The thing is still unfinished and now it's been almost four years.

Have a great time when you visit the Dharma Center. This is a different school than what I study, but in the same tradition. It is a great thing you are doing with your children. Tara is like the Blessed Mother, or a saint, or goddess. What she actually is, is a woman who reached enlightenment and who is now a perfectly completed Buddha for the sake of all.

Even if you aren't Buddhists, it is always very auspicious to prostrate in the shrine, three times.

Reply to
Jangchub

It went to Europe with someone, I don't remember now. It was gone for many months where nobody worked on it. Get YOUR facts straight. Is it finished yet? No.

Reply to
Jangchub

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