I give and give and give to the woodturning community and this is the thanks I get? Did you really think it wouldn't get back to me? I expected as much from Herm and Eugene. They are Canadians after all. But Pam? This really cuts to the bone. You will all be lucky if I don't just quit participating in these forums. I suspect if I left you to the Bigamists to do with as they liked you would all change your tune. God bless you in spite of yourselves, Al Kyder